Decal search

[Don in Cincinnati]

Does anyone know of an in-stock source for ULAD 1/72 scale decal sheets #7201 and #7203? (I need the laughing swordfish for my U-96 and another boat to be built at a later date.)

I have tried Squadron, Great Models, White Ensign, Mickster and a host of others and all are out of stock.

Any suggestions will be appreciated.

Don

[Greif]

Hi Don, let me check some German model stores and I will get back with you.

Ernest

Does anyone know of an in-stock source for ULAD 1/72 scale decal sheets #7201 and #7203? (I need the laughing swordfish for my U-96 and another boat to be built at a later date.)

I have tried Squadron, Great Models, White Ensign, Mickster and a host of others and all are out of stock.

Any suggestions will be appreciated.

Don

[billp51d]

        Hi Don..I don't mean to sound negative but many of the ULAD's are out of production. The latest I saw any were in local hobby shops. Finding any here in the states is tough.. Good luck in your quest..
                                            Regards..  Bill in Delaware

[Greif]

Hi Don, I looked in every shop I order from in Germany without any luck.  Bill is correct that the three sheets are oop.  However, there is another option for you.  In Germany there is a small producer of decals called Peddinghaus.  They make several 1/72 scale uboot decal sheets.  I have attached the sheet they make that has the Laughing Swordfish on it for you to look at.  I have another of their sheets; I have not used any of the decals yet, but they look ok on the sheet.  A sheet costs Euro 7.14 plus shipping.  If you are interested let me know; I can order the sheet, and mail it to you through my APO address which would be cheaper then international mail.

Ernest

[Don in Cincinnati]

Hi Don, I looked in every shop I order from in Germany without any luck.  Bill is correct that the three sheets are oop.  However, there is another option for you.  In Germany there is a small producer of decals called Peddinghaus.  They make several 1/72 scale uboot decal sheets.  I have attached the sheet they make that has the Laughing Swordfish on it for you to look at.  I have another of their sheets; I have not used any of the decals yet, but they look ok on the sheet.  A sheet costs Euro 7.14 plus shipping.  If you are interested let me know; I can order the sheet, and mail it to you through my APO address which would be cheaper then international mail.

Ernest

Ernest:

Thanks so much for your effort. I have two possible sources for ULAD as of this minute, but each is on backorder so I'm thinking my chances are slim to none. I should know in a few days.

I know this may sound picky, but I really wanted the emblem in dark blue or black (As in Das Boot) and, with six months into this build I'd really like to finish it my way if at all possible.

At present my son, who is a graphic designer and has a Mac computer, has offered to do artwork so I can have the emblem made in dry transfer which is my favorite way to work this sort of thing. It will be pricey, but at this point I have adopted a what-the-hell attitude which would drive any money manager a little daffy.

Please don't think that you efforts have been in vain. I may yet take advantage of your generous offer. I appreciate your time and interest.

Don

[Greif]

Hi Don, there is another decal sheet by Peddinghaus which does have the Laughing Swordfish in black.  I have attached a picture of it.  Actually, it is the sheet that I have at home.  If you are interested, I can remove the two swordfish and mail them to you.

Ernest

[Don in Cincinnati]

Hi Don, there is another decal sheet by Peddinghaus which does have the Laughing Swordfish in black.  I have attached a picture of it.  Actually, it is the sheet that I have at home.  If you are interested, I can remove the two swordfish and mail them to you.

Ernest

Ernest:

Way to go, Ernest! Yes indeed, I am interested. I would be more than happy to pay you for the decals and the shipping. The next few days are going to be pretty busy as I need to repair a leaky roof, but let's talk via the Personal Message feature on this site and iron out the details.
 
I really appreciate this, Ernest.

All the best,
Don

[dougie47]

Hi guys,

Following this discussion, Wink and I have been thinking of producing sawfish decals as an AMP product. We've still to get quotes but we will probably do them soon-ish. The decals would need a varnish over the top, and we're thinking of doing them in dark green and dark blue. This is to cover ourselves in the big U 96 sawfish colour debate!

Don, if Ernest's decals are fine then go with them. But we'll keep you posted on the above in due course.

Cheers,

Dougie

[Don in Cincinnati]

Hi guys,

Following this discussion, Wink and I have been thinking of producing sawfish decals as an AMP product. We've still to get quotes but we will probably do them soon-ish. The decals would need a varnish over the top, and we're thinking of doing them in dark green and dark blue. This is to cover ourselves in the big U 96 sawfish colour debate!

Don, if Ernest's decals are fine then go with them. But we'll keep you posted on the above in due course.

Cheers,

Dougie

Dougie:

While Ernest has been kind enough to share his decals I will probably order these from you when available as I want to do several more boats.

As to the ongoing color debate one thought occured to me; If Lothar-Gunther Buchheim is still alive perhaps he could shed some light on what color the U-96 carried. Have you thought about trying to contact him?

All the best,
Don

[Greif]

Hi Don, sadly Herr Buchheim passed away three years ago.  I don't think he would have been able to shed much light on the color of the emblem.  While he was alive there was a great deal of debate amongst uboot men about the accuracy of his writings.  As to the correct color, even uboot men have argued, and continue to do so, about what the actual color was.  Like alot of things in history, I don't think there will ever be a "definitive" answer to that question.

Ernest 

Hi guys,

Following this discussion, Wink and I have been thinking of producing sawfish decals as an AMP product. We've still to get quotes but we will probably do them soon-ish. The decals would need a varnish over the top, and we're thinking of doing them in dark green and dark blue. This is to cover ourselves in the big U 96 sawfish colour debate!

Don, if Ernest's decals are fine then go with them. But we'll keep you posted on the above in due course.

Cheers,

Dougie

Dougie:

While Ernest has been kind enough to share his decals I will probably order these from you when available as I want to do several more boats.

As to the ongoing color debate one thought occured to me; If Lothar-Gunther Buchheim is still alive perhaps he could shed some light on what color the U-96 carried. Have you thought about trying to contact him?

All the best,
Don

[Don in Cincinnati]

Hi Don, sadly Herr Buchheim passed away three years ago.  I don't think he would have been able to shed much light on the color of the emblem.  While he was alive there was a great deal of debate amongst uboot men about the accuracy of his writings.  As to the correct color, even uboot men have argued, and continue to do so, about what the actual color was.  Like alot of things in history, I don't think there will ever be a "definitive" answer to that question.

Ernest 

Hi guys,

Following this discussion, Wink and I have been thinking of producing sawfish decals as an AMP product. We've still to get quotes but we will probably do them soon-ish. The decals would need a varnish over the top, and we're thinking of doing them in dark green and dark blue. This is to cover ourselves in the big U 96 sawfish colour debate!

Don, if Ernest's decals are fine then go with them. But we'll keep you posted on the above in due course.

Cheers,

Dougie

Dougie:

While Ernest has been kind enough to share his decals I will probably order these from you when available as I want to do several more boats.

As to the ongoing color debate one thought occured to me; If Lothar-Gunther Buchheim is still alive perhaps he could shed some light on what color the U-96 carried. Have you thought about trying to contact him?

All the best,
Don

Ernest:

Thanks for the info. After deciding that I wanted to build a boat with the swordfish insigna, (The designer in me thinks it's one of the coolest emblems, I guess) U-96 became the natural choice.

I then read Dougie's article on it and began to look hard at wartime photos of boats with the fish. Based on what I can see I have come to the conclusion that it was most likely different colors on different boats. For example on several boats the mouth portion of the emblem is a different value i.e. lighter or darker than the body. That suggests two colors to me. On others the entire insogna appears to be a single value, or one color. I have tried to factor in other considerations such as sunlight and shadow as well as variations in the CT paint color. And that's why I decided to build more than one boat each with a different color fish. It's the old shotgun approach; keep shooting and sooner or later you'll hit something.

The net result of all this search as well as Dougie's input leaves me with the conclusion that it is highly likely that more than one color was used among the boats sporting that swordfish. At that point it really becomes an educated guess as to what color a specific boat had at the time a photograph was taken.

One final thought here. As I understand it KL Lehmann-Willenbrock was hired as a consultant for Das Boat and that boat had a black swordfish. In my mind had that been the wrong color he might have spoken to Petersen about it. Now I know that he might have missed this -or maybe didn't really care- or maybe was ignored because the production team liked the black insigna, but based on that thin line of reasoning I wanted the first build to have a black laughing swordfish. Such is the vanity of an old designer like me.

Don

[dougie47]

Hi gentlemen,

The answer of the sawfish colour is an ever elusive one isn't it! I'm almost certain we will never know. Although I wrote a brief article on it, I am happy to concede that I don't know the answer either.

I have a hunch regarding the Das Boot insignia. In a few b&w photos of U 96 the insignia actually looks black. I reckon there is a fair chance the production team saw those photos and thought, what the heck, it looks black to me. And then opted for black on the movie U 96. But...it is just a hunch!

Cheers,

Dougie

[Don in Cincinnati]

Hi gentlemen,

The answer of the sawfish colour is an ever elusive one isn't it! I'm almost certain we will never know. Although I wrote a brief article on it, I am happy to concede that I don't know the answer either.

I have a hunch regarding the Das Boot insignia. In a few b&w photos of U 96 the insignia actually looks black. I reckon there is a fair chance the production team saw those photos and thought, what the heck, it looks black to me. And then opted for black on the movie U 96. But...it is just a hunch!

Cheers,

Dougie

I agree, Dougie, and that elusive information gives us modelers some leeway in personalizing out boats without opening us up to charges of historical inaccuracy.
And of course, the neutral gray background of the tower is perfect for any reasonable color swordfish, be it green, blue, red or black.

So far as U-96 is concerned you may well be right about the production crew decision. But if that is so, they didn't study the photo you e-mailed to me some time back from page 146 (top) of Robert Stern's book Type VII U-boats -it's the one with the swordfish on the sides and the snorting bull on the front of the tower. If that picture is examined very closely the mouth of the swordfish is, as I mentioned in another post, a lighter value than the body which suggests TWO colors. (Three counting the white outline and eye.)

In any event it's fun to try to puzzle the riddle out despite the lack of any definitive answer looming on the horizon.
Now if you and Wink could just offer an AMP time machine......

Don

[Rokket]

Already worked on the time machine, waiting for it to come back..or maybe we will work on it in the future, but, oh I dunno

[Don in Cincinnati]

Already worked on the time machine, waiting for it to come back..or maybe we will work on it in the future, but, oh I dunno

Can it really BE the future if you are in it now?