Visited the USS Ling today

[bill_c]

I have lived in the area for over 20 years, but only recently realized the USS Ling is moored in nearby Hackensack, NJ. One of the last Balao-class boats to enter the service, she is a private museum that shows off the interior of the vessel quite well. My 20 year-old son and I recently watched "Destination Tokyo," which is pretty corny in spots, but was a good match with the Director's cut of "Das Boot" we'd seen a few days before that. So we went today and it's a pleasure to see the old girl is doing pretty well, all things considered.

The tour stays only on the main deck, with the conning tower and bilges/batteries off-limits. But the boat is detailed to resemble the late war period (though the Ling never heard a shot fired in anger). All in all, it gave me a great feeling for what it was like to be aboard one of these vessels. Certainly not for those with claustrophobia, LOL!

http://www.njnm.com/

[Division 6]

I have Destination Tokyo on right now.

Keep in mind that it was made as a Propaganda film so everything American is wholesome with lot's of talk about home, family and God and the Japanese are raised to be blood thirsty killers that don't appreciate their women.
It also had the Doolittle Raid that was more for morale than anything else, again Propaganda.

Nice that it used actual footage from the launch where Midway used a reenactment from some other film.

Now the interesting thing is that some of the footage like at port and some of the actual submarine images where first used in Crash Dive (1943) and where in color, Destination Tokyo came out a year later in 1944 in black and white.

Than in 1959 Up Periscope used the same B/W model shots from Destination Tokyo.

They use the same stupid torpedo launch shot in Crash Dive, Destination Tokyo and Run Silent Run Deep.
All torpedoes come out of the same tube that never opens. (amazing)

Eric...

[bill_c]

I had already read that the interior sets for the movie were meant to be more-spacious than the actual boats, but interestingly the interior wasn't as cramped as I expected. Small, yes, but with some nice creature comforts, including an ice cream machine (WWII or post-war? The guide didn't know).

The reality of the war is much different than the movies. Mush Morton's decision to machine gun Japanese castaways is the most-extreme example, but there were other instances of where the US was less than angelic. General Sherman's dictum about war being "all hell" rings just as true today as in the Civil War.

[Rokket]

Wow, glad to have a review of Ling. Been to Lion fish in Fall River.

Saw Destination:Tokyo a few months back,enjoyable for all the good and bad and various that you guys mention. Something I've always found interesting: People who lived through the time of Pearl Harbor have a different viewpoint than us youngsters. My friend's mother could have been classified a Saint. her generosity and kindness and pure warmth were almost legendary. She suffered loss and experienced joy. She was a lovely woman. BUT...because she lived through the time of PH, and her husband was a young LT fighting afterwards, she really had no time for the Japanese, and I'm being polite in my phrasing. She was all for the Atomic Bomb. Same for her male friend of many years, the same age. Interesting.

Mush Morton- some versions say the survivors were shooting at the Evil yanks, and he decided "OK, we'll shoot back". Others say he was a maniac. But there are the same tales of Uboat commanders, some who rammed lifeboats and others who gave torpedo survivors water and a compass.

Sherman - well, on one hand, its war, and you'r teaching a lesson. You're ruthless. On the other, there's the parallel of Stalingrad. The civilians just wanted to survive, and were robbed of food and suplies by both their own army and the invading Germans. Sooooo many died.

Ice Cream maker - WWII.  A few books I've read all mention them, they weren't standard issue, and probably most boats didn't have them, but they were real.

[Division 6]

I was reading that the Germans and Brits thought Americans had pleasure boats since they had showers and a laundry machine.
Guess they didn't know about the occasional ice cream maker.

The most important piece of equipment was the coffee maker.


I went through the Pampanito in SF back in 81 when it was still being set up as a museum, they where working on the fairwater while I was there.
Tried to get to it a couple years ago but the price of parking is beyond robbery these days, $6 for 20 minutes.
It used to be $6 for the whole day.

One of these days I'll go back over there.

Eric...

[Rokket]

$6 / 20? WHAT?!!! That's Citizen's Revolution talk that is. Wow!

[Division 6]

That was the cheapest parking lot I could find in the entire Wharf area, about 4 blocks from the boat.

Eric...

[bill_c]

Well, the Ling's parking is free, but you have to go to Hackensack, LOL! 

Most evidence I have read shows Morton as ordering his men to fire on the Japanese survivors. Also have read with at least two other boats that went down the Japanese threw overboard any of the wounded sailors. They beheaded some of the Marine commandoes who landed on Guadalcanal. So I'm sure that many fighting the war had strong emotions about their enemies.

Walk a mile in another man's shoes....

Regarding Sherman, he believed it was actually more humane to wage total war because it got the suffering over faster.

Certainly reading Silent Victory I am convinced a little more brain cells on our side would have shortened the war in the Pacific. Blair says the submarine war against Japan didn't really begin until 1944 when we:

1.) Got rid of the MK VI magnetic exploder
2.) Tested the MK XIV and found its true running depth
3.) Started going after the Janese merchant ships and tankers instead of focusing on capital ships (of which we sank very few)

The sad thing with the Ling is the Bergen Record newspaper owns the land and wants them to move. The ship isn't seaworthy, has a leak in one of its saddle tanks, and some of the bridges on the Hackensack River no longer open to let her pass through. Ideally she should be down in Camden with the USS New Jersey.

[Mike K]

In regard to the ice cream machines.
I've heard many stories about how US Boats "acquired" ice cream machines, even though they were not standard issue.
While it may not have been standard practice, it was not unusual, for a sub crew to steal a machine, if the opportunity arose.
Perhaps, the US and Royal Navies', high command, opinion, that Submariners were half brother to pirates, was closer to truth, than insult.
One storey, of note, was told to me by a guy who was on a brand new Gato, in early 42, out of Pearl.
They were tied up near a Carrier, under going extensive repairs (Yorktown before Midway?).
A chief, on board, put together a volunteer, working party, and paperwork, and headed to the Carrier.
They approached the Carrier's Supply Officer and had him sign off on the work order (talk about "stones"!!). They, then, proceeded to the mess deck, where they removed the machine, transported it back to the boat and installed it.
Nothing was ever heard about it, and it was still aboard when my friend left. the boat.
Perhaps, the loss of Yorktown, at Midway, saved their butts. We'll probably never know, since my buddy died several years ago, and he never said, and I never asked, which Carrier it was.
With the datails he gave, if he wasn't the Chief, he was part of the "working party.

Mike K.

[Rokket]

Wow, you're right about "stones"! Mike! I can see it all happening in my head. Great stuff!