AMP - Accurate Model Parts
SEA => SUBS: Uboats => TYPE VII => Topic started by: Greif on 03 Feb , 2010, 02:03
-
Hi everyone, I am undecided as to what project I should start next. Soooo, I thought it would be cool to let my fellow modellers vote to help me decide. Below is a little background on each of the four contenders.
1) The RoG Bismarck was this year's christmas gift from my wife. I have never built a surface ship, and was not all that interested in building this one at first. In fact, I was going to trade it for a group of 1/48 scale aircraft until my oldest son told my wife what I planned. She expressed disappointment that I did not like the present, we have been married 21 years now - and knowing which buttons to push - she said, "Well I guess it is too hard for you to build because it has all those parts. So go ahead and trade it for something easier." With those two sentences, she made sure I WOULD build this kit, shrewd. :P The more I look at the box, the more it grows on me; and my interest has now been sparked. I have ordered Eduard's "Railings and Turrets" detail set. Other then that, I plan to do an OOB build for this kit. This would be a long term build due to the size of the kit.
2) CMK's Control Room would be the third of four builds that I am working on for my Type VII uboat project. I would be putting the same time and scratchbuilding effort into it as I did for the two previous builds. The Control Room would be one part of a large project; and like an elephant, you have to eat it one bite at a time! ;)
3) I have wanted to build Tamiya's He-219 for a while now. I have the Aires cockpit kit for this model and a couple of other small aftermarket sets. The build would include a simple diorama base with a figure or two. The build would be fairly straightforward with, hopefully, no fuss or muss.
4) The Pak has been built and painted, all it needs is weathered, for a few years now, and it has been sitting in a box waiting for an idea from me to finish it. I also have several figures that are very nearly complete, they were to be used for a build that just did not turn out at all, to use in a diorama. The idea is to put the Pak in a firing position, with the infantrymen around it to give close in protection; prehaps in a trench, prehaps not. The scene would depict the Pak and infantry preparing to engage an approaching enemy.
I look forward to your votes!
Ernest
-
Id like to see the PAK finished. Perhaps in whitewash on eastern front. ;)
-
I vote for...hmmm...nr. 1. I love those DKM-capital-ships - they have a very nice shape. But a 1/350 surface-ship-kit is a big challenge. Before I started with the U-Boot, i tried to build a 1/350 Yamato and got lost in detail...
-
Ernest, I voted for the He-219 "Uhu" as i think it a nice looking aircraft. It remember me a little of the A-10 Thunderbolt
-
Tight race so far. While looking through the stash this evening I pulled out the 1/35 figures that I mentioned in option 4. The figures represent Waffen SS infantry in summer camo. I handpainted the camo patterns, which show all three camo patterns the Waffen SS used during WWII. The Oakleaf and Planetree patterns predominated; the Pea Pattern was seen much less. I still have to paint the boots and finish washing the figures and then spray them with a matt coat. Once I do that the camo patterns will seem to blend much bette,r the colors are a bit garish right now. Hopefullythis doe not influence anyone's vote, I just wanted to show off the camo schemes a bit as they turned rather well. :P
Siara my friend, that means no winter white wash and camo, if this entry turns out to be the winner. :-[
Ernest
-
I'm with Jan on building the KMS Bismark. Sure, there's lots of detail but as you can tell from my other posts, for me, the more detail, the more work, the better.
I haven't built Bismark but years ago I did do her sister ship, Tirpitz and it was an impressive ship. I could help with a lot of suggestions since I'm probably more specialized in surface ships than sub-surface.
-
I voted for the big ship. Theres something about the big capital ships that have always been a fav with me....maybe its the guns that can fire shells that weigh as much as a car, gotta love that. Build the big shp Greif...you know you want to....
-
I recommend option 4. Interested in your approach to painting techniques with this subject.
Bill
-
Hi Bill, if you mean the technique I used for the camo patterns I'll give a short description of how I did the "Oakleaf" pattern:
After priming with Tamiya white primer as normal I sprayed the predominate color of medium green. The next step was the laying of the Oak Leaf camouflage pattern. Looking at references, there are several patterns on one smock, but not one is distinct . In other words, there are no consistent patterns. The "leaf" prints on the actual smocks were randomly applied and this makes the task of modelling them so much easier. The pattern consists of a random array of a muddy dark brown, and a dark green pattern similar to the colour of oak leaves in the shade. I started out by laying in the irregular patches using a mix of Tamiya Red Brown (any brown will do) mixed with a bit of Black. The brown patches should cover about 40% of the smock and pants surface. Let this dry for about thirty minutes. I added a series of dark green patches, Tamiya's XF27, and I also outlined the medium green areas with the dark green.
At this point the figure should be covered about 65% in non-descript patches of medium and dark green and brown. I then used the two greens and a slightly lightened brown of the above colors and applied blotches by stippling the brush onto the smock and pants. Perfect round dots are not what you are trying to capture but rather "blotches". Apply blotches of the dark green onto medium green, brown blotches on the dark green, and medium green blotches on both. Quite frankly, the best brush for this is an old beat up brush which has hardened hairs. Ensure you add thinner every time you lay colors for ease of flow. acrylic paints dry very quickly and, blotches will become clumps after five minutes of exposure to air if not properly thinned. I examined the figure to see if there were areas that need filling. I kept adding blotches until 85% of my figure was covered.
Once dry, I added Tamiya Smoke in the shadow areas. I mixed Smoke with alcohol 50/50 and let it run into the crevices and crannies. Very light coats at a time. I still need to spray a matt coat. This will immediately reduce the shine from the Smoke and soften the edges of the colors giving a nice muted blending effect. The second picture above does a better job showing the technique then I just did explaining it.
Ernest
I recommend option 4. Interested in your approach to painting techniques with this subject.
Bill
-
Hi Ernest,
I voted for the Bismarck primarily because it is such a good looking battleship. I built the Tamiya 350th Bismarck a while back and very much enjoyed this build. The Revell Bismarck is, I believe, a better kit, and would make a very cool model. There is plenty of reference material available online for the Bismarck too. I reckon you would enjoy this build much more than you anticipate. And it would keep the missus happy!
The Heinkel makes a good model too with camo, weathering, radar and open cockpits.
Cheers,
Dougie
-
Griffon, it's starting to look like a surface ship build.
If so, you should get the cherry veneer that I talked about and gave the source information to in another thread.
Since the decks on Bismark wouldn't be stained, it's even more impressive with real wood ones.
-
Ernest,
Many thanks for the detailed description on the painting technique. Just two quick questions - first, have you tried this technique with enamels? Secondly, how is the Tamiya Smoke applied - with a brush or cotton bud or?
Cheers,
Bill
-
Hi Bill,
I have not tried painting Waffen SS camo with enamels, but I don't think doing so would be a problem. I apply the tamiya smoke mix with a 000 brush. One could also effectively use one of the special made washes from War Pigs, Vallejo, etc. I have to mention that painting the camo patterns in 1/35 scale is very challenging, and I have not perfected it yet. If you are planning to try your hand at painting them, I recommend starting with a larger scale. I did a nice little vignette using Verlinden's old 120mm Waffen SS Machinegun Team several years ago. Painting the camo scheme, I chose the "Oakleaf" pattern, was not too hard and turned out pretty well; I won first prize in a contest with the build at any rate.
Having said the above, I don't think there are any modellers on this site who could not master the technique with a little practice.
Ernest
Ernest,
Many thanks for the detailed description on the painting technique. Just two quick questions - first, have you tried this technique with enamels? Secondly, how is the Tamiya Smoke applied - with a brush or cotton bud or?
Cheers,
Bill
-
Hi Dougie, it is looking like the Bismarck is pulling ahead. If it does win, I will be asking the more experienced surface ship builders alot of questions. :D
Ernest
Hi Ernest,
I voted for the Bismarck primarily because it is such a good looking battleship. I built the Tamiya 350th Bismarck a while back and very much enjoyed this build. The Revell Bismarck is, I believe, a better kit, and would make a very cool model. There is plenty of reference material available online for the Bismarck too. I reckon you would enjoy this build much more than you anticipate. And it would keep the missus happy!
The Heinkel makes a good model too with camo, weathering, radar and open cockpits.
Cheers,
Dougie
-
While waiting for the voting to end, I have been working on those Waffen SS figures. As I have mentioned they have been sitting in a box waiting to be completed. I have finished 4 of the 7 figures. The deep shadow areas were given a wash of Tamiya Smoke thinned 50/50 with alcohol. After that dried, I gave each figures two light glazes of an earth brown color to soften and blend the camo edges. They were then sprayed with Vallejo Matt Coat to flatten the finish and further tone and blend everything. Finally, each figure was brushed with ground pastels, a mix of black and brown, to "dirty them up" with a ground color. Its been a while since I have done in 1/35 scale figure painting and it took a bit of time to get back in the saddle. Overall, I give the figures a C to B grade. What do you guys think?
Ernest
-
Ernest,
They look pretty good to me. I have always shied away from figures, have never been very good at painting that type stuff. After seeing all the work done by the members here, I'm getting an itch to give it a try....maybe at 1/72 for my gato......
-
Griffon, any ideas wanted for surface ships, I'll be happy to help.
-
As you guys have already discussed, painting figures is an important, and sometimes highly personal, technique that makes a huge difference in how they turn out.
One of the things that I do with figures painting to make them look more realistic is to use special brushes that I've cut down for the purpose. For things like buttons, eyeballs (even irises if the scale allows), some of my brushes consist of only one or two hairs. To steady your hand, rest it on top of a padded rest or even your other wrist, so that only your fingertips can move. The piece being painted can be held in some sort of clip or vice under a magnifying glass if that helps you.
Another thing that's often overlooked though is drilling and cutting. The drilling is simple, I use a very fine drill to hollow out such things as the nostrils and ear canals. Sometimes a glass in the hand can be made from clear plastic sprue (from aircraft and car models) drilled out and then filled with thinned enamel paint.
The cutting is for things like pant and sleeve cuffs, and undercutting lapels and ties (some uniforms, like tankers often wear ties) and around the collars. To do this, I use a hot knife to make the initial cut, and then a scalpel/X-acto knife to smooth out the edges.
Anything like belts, webbing straps, epaullettes and packs should be cut off and then replaced with either sheet styrene, paper, tissue or whatever else will give the right effect. The idea is to create realistic shadow lines that just can't be achieved with painting.
For example, with a soldier wearing a bedroll, I'd cut off and discard the plastic bedroll and make a new one out of rolled up tissue (1 ply), painted appropriately and then bound with straps made of painted paper. Buckles can be made out of brass wire, bent into the correct shape and then hammered flat. Buttons can also be made by drilling and putting brass wire in the holes.
-
That seems like the best way to go, pat, much more real. Thanks for sharing your secrets
-
I haven't tried it (mainly because the last time I made a diorama was 20 years ago - it's rare to find a diorama with tall ship models) but a technique I learned a while ago to add some realism in a diorama was to make bottles or stemwear for your figures.
Again, use clear plastic sprue from aircraft or car models (never throw out clear sprue - coloured fine, there's lots of it but the clear stuff seems irreplaceable).
On a lathe, just turn the sprue at very slow speed into the correct shape. If you don't have a lathe, just put the sprue into a drill chuck and hold a sharp blade or bit of sandpaper against it. Don't use a file because if you go too fast, the sprue melts and it's the devil to get out of a file.
Once you have the right shape, just hold it in a pair of forceps and wave it over a candle flame to polish it. If you want the bottle partially filled, drill out from the bottom, put in thinned enamel, and then plug the bottom with thick CA. Fill stemwear and other glasses the same way, just don't plug them.
Slainte!
-
Couldn't agree more about technique being a highly personal choice. I don't modify my figures much any more. I mostly use figures made by Jaguar, Hornet and Warriors; with a few by DML also. They are pretty highly detailed straight out of the box, with crisp molding and fine features. Guess I'm just getting lazy as I get older!
Back to your point though, I have not jumped on the acrylics bandwagon for painting faces. I still use artists oils and the techniques I learned 25 years ago, and to be honest I have never seen a reason to change. Armed with a good set of Windsor&Newton #7 brushes, I am comfortable laying in oils.
I will definitely be asking you some questions regarding warship construction when I start my Bismarck build. I plan to keep construction mostly OOB as I dip my toe in, so to speak.
Ernest
As you guys have already discussed, painting figures is an important, and sometimes highly personal, technique that makes a huge difference in how they turn out.
One of the things that I do with figures painting to make them look more realistic is to use special brushes that I've cut down for the purpose. For things like buttons, eyeballs (even irises if the scale allows), some of my brushes consist of only one or two hairs. To steady your hand, rest it on top of a padded rest or even your other wrist, so that only your fingertips can move. The piece being painted can be held in some sort of clip or vice under a magnifying glass if that helps you.
Another thing that's often overlooked though is drilling and cutting. The drilling is simple, I use a very fine drill to hollow out such things as the nostrils and ear canals. Sometimes a glass in the hand can be made from clear plastic sprue (from aircraft and car models) drilled out and then filled with thinned enamel paint.
The cutting is for things like pant and sleeve cuffs, and undercutting lapels and ties (some uniforms, like tankers often wear ties) and around the collars. To do this, I use a hot knife to make the initial cut, and then a scalpel/X-acto knife to smooth out the edges.
Anything like belts, webbing straps, epaullettes and packs should be cut off and then replaced with either sheet styrene, paper, tissue or whatever else will give the right effect. The idea is to create realistic shadow lines that just can't be achieved with painting.
For example, with a soldier wearing a bedroll, I'd cut off and discard the plastic bedroll and make a new one out of rolled up tissue (1 ply), painted appropriately and then bound with straps made of painted paper. Buckles can be made out of brass wire, bent into the correct shape and then hammered flat. Buttons can also be made by drilling and putting brass wire in the holes.
-
The Bismarck wins going away - much like the Saints last night. Construction begins when I get home from work today. I have already started a thread in the "Battleship" section for those interested.
Ernest
-
Excellent! You have a cool model, great history, new stuff, and pleasing the Missus