Need help with PE

[bracco_n]

Hello everybody, while navigating the internet I discovered the Griffon PE set for Revell's 1/144 Type VIIC. I'm sure you already knew about it. The fact is that seeing it I decided I want to build one with that beautiful PE. It is said that this is a very difficult PE to work with and experience is needed. While working on U-1023 I used the eduard set without much knoweledge and things turned out acceptably well, maybe because of the scale. But PE on 1/144 must be another thing.
With this post I intend that you experienced modellers could teach me how to work with PE (how to turn it, to cut it properly, hand it, which glues to use, etc.)
Thanks in advance!

[TRM]

Bracco_n,

I think if you had favorable results from using PE on your 1023, you will do just fine.  There is a ton of info (tricks) within this site and on the net. 

CA (Cyanoacrylate) or super glue works really well.  There are different thicknesses and accelerators.  The accelerators are nice with railings and other free standing items.  You can solder some pieces with soldering paste and I have seen white glue used in some applications.

Cutting....a small tile, piece of glass or plexi work exceptionally well as a cutting surface.  A very sharp single edge blade to cut the pieces out.  Extremely small pieces, double over some masking tape and place on the glass...no matter how hard you try or how experienced you may be, there will be that one piece that takes off like a rocket....1mm x 1mm if virtuall impossible to find once launched.

Bending, I found either two staight edge razor blades, one to hold the piece down on the glass and the other slip in under the part to be bent.  Secornd is a small pair of bull nose pliers.  Prefferably one without grooves in the jaws.  Hold tight and bend with a razor.

Hope some of this helps.

Good luck, hope to see some pics!

Cheers!

[Pepper-mint]

Hi Bracco_n,

Is it the torpedo loading Kit ?

Anyway, some of the PE parts you can find in the 1/72 are frequently as "small" as the 1/144 parts. Like TRM, i think you'll do just fine.

Cheers
Pepper

[Pat]

For that 1mm x 1mm piece that "takes off like a rocket", I've found that the best way to find them (other than TRM's idea of the tape that aborts the launch in the first place - good suggestion, wish I'd thought of it) is to use a flashlight.  There always seems to be one tiny piece, no matter how careful you are, that gets away.

Doesn't matter how well lit the room is, if you hold a flashlight horizontally right at the floor level, it will usually cause the piece to cast a shadow.  It's the shadow you look for, not the piece itself and even 1mm will cast a bit of one.

[bracco_n]

I didn't quite understand the bending procedure, could somebody show me some images or direct me to a website that shows this?
Thanks for the input!

[Siara]

Few months ago i bought the tool called "Etchmate".
Here`s the link to the article about it:
Etchmate

[Pepper-mint]

I have the Etchmate too. A "must have" for PE building, brass scratch building and also for styrene sheets...

If you don't want to invest, you can work with 2 sharp edged sheets of plexiglass.

You clamp your PE part between the sheets, the bending zone along the edge of the upper plexi sheet. With a sharp cutter blade you "lift" and bend your PE part to the needed angle. this allows you a 90

[Rokket]

My Mate has an etchmate, loves it

[Mr. Bill]

All of the above is excellent advice for working with PE.  Just a few additional suggestions to consider.

If you make a mistake, it is often possible to salvage the part by carefully flattening it on a hard surface by rolling a smooth cylindrical object over it until it is flat again.  You may have to turn the part over and roll from different directions, but in most cases the part can be restored to new condition.

Another thing to consider is to rough the contact surface of the part up a bit with fine grit sandpaper so that it grips better when cemented in place.  This will also help remove any residual chemicals on the brass that may effect paint adhesion.

Last thing to think about is how to find tiny lost parts.  Go to Wife or Girlfriend and ask to borrow a pair of stockings.  Place the stocking over the nozzle of a vacuum cleaner.  Turn the vacuum on and run it gently around the area of the floor/carpet that you think the part may be.  The missing part (even very tiny ones) can be recovered this way - just be sure to place the nozzle over a container before you turn the vacuum off or the part will be lost again on the floor.   Don't forget to appropriately thank owner of stockings.

Cheers,

Bill

[Pat]

Two excellent ideas Mr. Bill!!!

I've used that method for flattening parts before (also used a palm-sized anvil I've got too) but I never thought of anything as effective as the stocking/vaccuum method for finding small parts.

Thanks for sharing!

[Rokket]

Bill - love the stocking idea!

Also try annealing - This is just making the metal more bendable with heat. Heat preferably on a hotplate or torch, and get it close to glowing, then cool it slowly (not quick chill, or it becomes brittle and less bendable, not more).

There's a great PE intro at www.paragrafix.biz/default.asp - got to www.paragrafix.biz/instructions/Photoetch_Demo_Handout_2009-144dpi.pdf. There are also a lot of great kits there, check them out!

[Pat]

Annealing is a good method, but may not always be possible and definitely takes a while.

I've usually had good luck by just bending the part VERY slowly.  A fast bend tends to be brittle and might develop cracks on the outside edge of the bend point.  Bending slowly usually works.

Also, scribing on the inside of where you you want the bend will help make it easier.  If I have to do that, I use the sharp edge of a triangular or half-circular needle file.  Just a couple of passes is normally enough.

But by all means, do NOT repeatedly bend back and forth as metal fatigue will make the part crack for sure.

[bracco_n]

Hello everybody! Thanks for the many replies!
university is almost over so the modelling season begins tomorrow. I've been checking both U-410 and U-1023 and decided that my skills have to improved. besides I'm dying for building a new boat. that's why I'm buying a 1/144 Type VIIC and if I can afford it a griffon PE set. still haven't decided which boat I'm going to do and what I'll be aiming to, I'll open a thread for that later.
well that's all for now, got to say that even though I don't comment on the threads I'm impressed with what you guys are doing, namely U826, U995, U69 to name a few.
Nicolas

[Pat]

Nicolas, I know what you mean about skills improving.

When I was young and building models, my skills didn't appear to imrove much from one model to the next.  But I've found that the older I get, the faster my skills improve to the point that any model I've built in the last 25 years, I've almost always looked at them when done and realized that I improved enough over the course of just one model that I know I could do it better right away.

In fact, I seldom do a build any more in which I don't rip out something I've done and redo it because I learned something since I started. 

Of course it help now that I'm to a point where I add so much detail that a typical build takes a couple years or more, and I seldom make any part that I don't do a lot of research on and semi-scratch or scratch build everything, so lots of time to learn new things.

[bracco_n]

Hello fellas. At the time I'm gathering information on building and painting techniques for my next build. Today I was checking my painting instruments and realized that an improvement has to be made there. What you are about to read might strike you: I never used primers or thinners, I can't tell the difference between enamels and... other kinds of paints, have two paintbrushes: a big one a and a small one, the paints I use are bought in the art shop two blocks down street and kids at kindergarten might be using the same paints. Never in life have I used oils or ink. As you can see I know nothing and work with low quality materials. tamiya, revell and such paints are very expensive here in argentina if you can find them. thankfully I have a friend who is at the states now and if I buy some stuff he'll bring it over. If you could point out some vital paints that I must have, say those used for metal parts, rust, etc...
Also, could you educate me on the basic use of paints?
I hope I'm not asking too much, I'm eager to learn and improve!