Uboat U-.... ?

[Pepper-mint]

Hello Fellows,

Yes i'm going to adopt a seven/forty-one  , but which one ?

All i decided for the moment is that :
1-i am going to build a type 7/41 as realistic and accurate as possible with all the documentation found here and there. (in the limits of my skills),
2-the general hull/camo paintings wished will be in the the NZSnowman's U-1308 style or like the pic below (i'm sure that this kind of painting/camouflage pattern has a name : "dazzle type" ?...)
exemple : U-201 / Brest 1941
3-the chosen N

[Pat]

Hi Pepper.

The style of camouflage in your picture lookes like what's called "dazzle camouflage", or sometimes "splinter pattern".  It was VERY common in WWI, not quite as common in WWII but still seen.  (I once saw a pic of a PT-boat in stripes like that. It was quite amazing)

The idea of it wasn't so much to hide the boat, like other paintjobs, but more to "dazzle" the enemy observers so that they couldn't tell the range or how faast it was moving, which would of course, throw off their gunnery.

Sometimes it was several colours, black, grey, white, blue, green, teal, etc.

I've seen it on a lot of troopships and freighters and it was very common for corvettes and MTB's/MGB's.

[NZSnowman]

Hi Pepper

Just a couple of about U-1308

U-1308 never had any camo paintings, in fact it was one of the few

[Pepper-mint]

Hi Gents,

Thanks for the details.

Pat, this is what i thought and all the pics i found are from WW1. The expected result from the "dazzle" painting was interesting.
A troubled view due to an unexpected camo destabilize you and make you lose time in taking decisions...

NZSnowman, your U-1308 would have been the "must have" seven/forty one U-boat for the KM ; with the well glued Alberich in bonus ! Today this kind of second skin is used for stealth properties on 30T. tanks like the bielorussian "2T STALKER"...

I have to make a choice to know what kind of radio/radar and all other particular devices where added and make the adequat research. My U-Boat must be as accurate as possible. Building this u-boat will take time, i will try not to make any mistake.

It seems to be difficult to find a Uboat with the "dazzle" paintings.

Maybe the U-307... I ike his story and his emblems

[Pat]

Pepper, yes, WWI was where dazzle camo was used most, but as I said, it was also found in WWII, just not as often. 

Too bad I don't know where I put my research on the PT boats.  I could give you the number of the one that had that pattern.  It was a really different pattern, more like a zebra striping than anything.

One well known ship with such disruptive camo was KMS Tirpitz.  It had black and white zigzags in the middle and the bow and stern were darker with a false bow wave painted further back to make the ship either look smaller or farther away.

U-119, a type XB, had a smaller U-boat painted on it's casing to make it look like a less tempting target.

U-141 and U-565 both had milder versions of dazzle camouflage, more like a disruptive pattern.

What about the boat in the picture you you posted?  Do you know the number for it or have a picture of the entire boat?

Here's some URLs on the origins and concept of the camouflage, with some pictures of WWI and WWIII ships with the pattern.  They didn't just use black and white either, but often reds, yellows, blues, greens, etc. 

http://leenks.com/link254001.html

http://www.answers.com/topic/razzle-dazzle

http://ministryoftype.co.uk/words/article/dazzle/

http://gcaptain.com/maritime/blog/a-gcaptain-hallowene-ships-in-razzle-dazzle-costume/

http://www.cbrnp.com/RNP/Flower/MODELS/Sackville/Sackville.htm

http://www.shipcamouflage.com/1_4.htm

http://www.risd.edu/dazzle/

Having spent a lot of time on the water, I can attest that brilliant white colours with much darker lines on them frequently make it difficult to identify a boat a distance in bright sunshine.

Whatever you decide with it, it does make a really attractive pattern and quite the conversation piece.
 

[Pepper-mint]

Pat,

Great...

Yes i saw the Tirpitz, and the paintings in his late version are very attractive. As wll as for the U-141 type IID and the U-565 type VIIC. (pic below)
The photo i posted is an excerpt from a 3D Uboat found on RADIO ROOM...
I ordered the mag. "U-BOOT IM FOCUS" N

[Greif]

Hi Pepper, I am planning to build U307 as the uboat for my interior build project.  Maybe we can trade notes!  The Uboot im Focus is a very valuable resource.

Ernest

[NZSnowman]

As U-1308 was the last Type VII's to be build and had Alberich (which I believe only 3 or 4 Type VII's got) I believe and I am sure the Germans were going all out with U-1308, they were planning to give her all the the newest toys like FuMT 1 Aphrodite, FuMT-2 Theti, Tarnmatte, FuMO-61 Hohentwiel-U and a Schnorchel before her first combat mission.

Also on a side note it was U-249 not U-570 with both FuMB-35 Athos & FuMO 65 Hohentwiel.

[Pat]

Good picture of the camo on U-565 Pepper.  I really shows off the pattern well.

One questino though.  There's a white rectangle on top of the CT that I haven't seen before.  Do you or anybody have any idea what it is?  Is it part of the boat or is it something they're holding up?

[Greif]

Pat, I'm sure it is not part of the uboat.  As it appears that the boat is returning from patrol, a pretty successful one considering the tonnage pennants, it might be a table describing the sinkings for that patrol or some such.

Ernest

Good picture of the camo on U-565 Pepper.  I really shows off the pattern well.

One questino though.  There's a white rectangle on top of the CT that I haven't seen before.  Do you or anybody have any idea what it is?  Is it part of the boat or is it something they're holding up?

[Pepper-mint]

Hi Gentlemen,

@ Greif,

With pleasure ! Mit viel vergn

[dougie47]

Hi gents,

I think the photo of the Med boat is U 81 rather than U 565. The vent holes are as per U 81. For example there are the 4 extra medium sized vents, which Vegesack boats such as U 81 had. The 25 vents on the top front row and the 17 circular holes below the 88mm are as per other U 81 photos.

The white board and pennants can be seen in other photos of U 81. The board listed all the boats they had sunk. Most of their victims were small vessels, with the notable exception of the carrier HMS Ark Royal.

Note that U 81 had a different camo scheme early in her career.

Cheers,

Dougie

[Jan]

Hi,

maybe U-453 would be a nice project for you, too? There is a drawing of it in Warship Pictorial No. 27, p. 44. It has a very cool camo-scheme. It is actually a VIIC, not a VIIC/41, but the differences between a late war VIIC and a VIIC/41 is not too big. Plus, according to the drawing it had a 2cm Flakvierling... I love the look of this weapon!

Greets

[Pepper-mint]

@ Dougie : You're the Doc' fellow 

Hi Jan,

Well, why not but i will have a problem with the flakvierling... I built a 1/35 scale maybe it could fit 

But : I found the book you are talking about on amazon. Is it worth the buying ? Is it a good documentation source ?
The U-boat painting on the "Warship Pictorial No. 27" cover is interesting... Do you have his code please ?
Thanks ...

Cheers,
Laurent

[Jan]

Yeah, the book is very good! It contains a lot of detail pics, so it is very helpful, regardless what boat you are building.

The boat on the cover is U-253.