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SEA => SUBS: Uboats => TYPE VII => Topic started by: bianco64squalo on 02 Jan , 2018, 04:19

Title: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: bianco64squalo on 02 Jan , 2018, 04:19: Hi eveybody,
Iâ€™m sorry to keep on asking help, but without assistance of experts of this forum, I canâ€™t start the construction of stern structure of my Trumpeter U-552 in 1/48 scale; I have the basic drawings of David Westwoodâ€™s book ( Anatomy of the ship ), but itâ€™s impossible for me ( altough Iâ€™m an architect, used to read drawings ), to put togheter plans and sections to have an 3D reconstruction of the stern structure.
In particular I canâ€™t understand the exact borders of aft buoyancy tank and main ballast tank 1, besides the position of various stringers and beams....
One more time I make my request, hoping for any help....
Thanks in advance.
Filippo
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: NZSnowman on 02 Jan , 2018, 12:28: I have not research the stern yet, I am still working on the saddle tanks. but have you tried:

http://www.ubootwaffe.pl/okrety/wyposazenie/zbiorniki-okretowe (http://www.ubootwaffe.pl/okrety/wyposazenie/zbiorniki-okretowe)
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: bianco64squalo on 02 Jan , 2018, 14:59: Thanks NZSnowman, but there is not useful materials on that site, I already knew it....
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: bianco64squalo on 15 Jan , 2018, 07:19: Hi everybody,
wainting the Planmappe: Uboottyp VII C [/size]that I ordered today, is there anyone who can highlight in the posted drawing the exact position of the various stringres on elevation plan ?[/color]
[/size]Thanks in advance.[/color]
[/size]Filippo[/color]
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: bianco64squalo on 16 Jan , 2018, 06:14: Hi everybody,
this is the last time I ask help to the forum's members about this question; if I'll obtain some new informartions, I'll try to do by myself.
For convenience, I post some drawings, extracted from David Westwood book, on which I indicated a part of my questions...
Any help is welcome.
Thanks in advance.
Filippo
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: NZSnowman on 16 Jan , 2018, 10:45: Re stringer height, quetion e. if you look on the Type VIIC/42 above. they look like they are marked on this plan.

I have to go to work now, but I take a look at the other quections tonight after work.
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: bianco64squalo on 16 Jan , 2018, 13:56: Hi NZSnowman, I did not understand your answer: itâ€™s criptic....
Iâ€™ll wait for more informations, when youâ€™ll have more time...
Thanks anyway...
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: NZSnowman on 17 Jan , 2018, 00:55: Hope this helps. Like I said before, I have research the stern so I do not know all the anwsers.

Page 1
a. The top of the keel.
c. I believe it one solid rod.
d. Three sections, two outside of pressure hull and one inside pressure.
e. two beam, one each side of the stern casting.

Page 2
B. No
C. No, the floor is flat. C is the aft training tank.
D. I have not seen any drawings.

Page 3.
A. I believe the support are into the tank.
C. This is the edge of the MB Tank 1.
E. Do you have any pictures of U-995 stern? You can see the stringers very easily.
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: bianco64squalo on 17 Jan , 2018, 02:19: Thanks Snowman,
I hope in other answers ( pag. 4 and 5 ) and other ideas, if available...
About your first replies:

PAG. 1:
a) the top of the keel is only a sign that shows the border of the keel, or it was a structure, like a plate; in this case, in consideration that the Ballast Tank. 1 was open to sea in its lower surface, was this plate perforated? And finally, the keel was part of MB Tank 1 ?
d) three sections? Which structure are you talking about ? The stern torpedosuppor arm is very far from pressre hull...
e) Were those two beams symmetrical ? Is there a drawing ( plan ) that indicates their position ?

PAG. 2:
b) ok, they are not what I tough, but were what ?

PAG. 3:
e) finally a good idea that I never though about: see the stringers from outside...I have many photo of Laboe U-995: I'll try to identify the stringers from hull plates deformations....
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: NZSnowman on 17 Jan , 2018, 10:34: Quote from: bianco64squalo on 17 Jan , 2018, 02:19
PAG. 3:
e) finally a good idea that I never though about: see the stringers from outside...I have many photo of Laboe U-995: I'll try to identify the stringers from hull plates deformations....

You can see the lines of rivets on the casting
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: NZSnowman on 17 Jan , 2018, 10:41: Quote from: bianco64squalo on 17 Jan , 2018, 02:19
PAG. 1:
a) the top of the keel is only a sign that shows the border of the keel, or it was a structure, like a plate; in this case, in consideration that the Ballast Tank. 1 was open to sea in its lower surface, was this plate perforated? And finally, the keel was part of MB Tank 1 ?

It’s the top of the aft keel casting, which is just below Stringer 1
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: NZSnowman on 17 Jan , 2018, 10:45: Quote from: bianco64squalo on 17 Jan , 2018, 02:19
d) three sections? Which structure are you talking about ? The stern torpedosuppor arm is very far from pressre hull...

The torpedo tude has three sections. It were no torpedo suppor arm, there a large size pipe that ran above and to one side that is the control arm to the torpedos door.
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: bianco64squalo on 18 Jan , 2018, 06:43: Hello,
I found this U-96 Hachette 1/48 from a German modeler.
I post some photos.
In your opinion the position asymmetrical of the two beams ( Stringer III ) is correct?
And what about the aft stern casing? Is it correct?
Thanks in advance for opinions...
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: David83 on 20 Jan , 2018, 12:38: Dear Filippo

you have the book of David Westwood you posted this picture before, you can see clearly that the both stringers are offset .

br David
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: bianco64squalo on 21 Jan , 2018, 03:46: Hi David,
I completely agree with you; I only was perplexed because of Snowmanâ€™s answer at my B question of figure n. 2; he stated that those two lines on drawing were not the stringers....
I have the greatest respect for his authority, but in this case Iâ€™m very doubtful....
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: NZSnowman on 21 Jan , 2018, 10:43: (https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4719/39787716412_dbcf967297_o.png)
The two yellow lines 'B' are the side wall of the tank. The stringers are marked in pink.

(https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4761/28041004109_2ebc77574d_o.jpg)
You can see the two stringer on the casting. The yellow box highlight the orange line in Q1 page 1
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: bianco64squalo on 22 Jan , 2018, 02:24: Thanks Snowman,
but there is a thing that I don't understand: if you look at the posted drawing, it seems that MBT 1 ( colored in green ) was large the whole hull, and not only between the two yellow lines of previous post: is this drawing wrong ?
And furthermore, is in your opinion the aft buoyancy tank ( colored in pink in the posted drawing ) correct in shape ?
Thanks in advance for replies....
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: David83 on 22 Jan , 2018, 10:07: Dear Fillipo

Thats from Kagero 3D Booklet maybe it helps .

br David
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: NZSnowman on 22 Jan , 2018, 10:31: Quote from: bianco64squalo on 22 Jan , 2018, 02:24
Thanks Snowman,
but there is a thing that I don't understand: if you look at the posted drawing, it seems that MBT 1 ( colored in green ) was large the whole hull, and not only between the two yellow lines of previous post: is this drawing wrong ?
And furthermore, is in your opinion the aft buoyancy tank ( colored in pink in the posted drawing ) correct in shape ?
Thanks in advance for replies....

The area for the MBT 1 looks Ok to me. The drawing is only of a single section of the boat.

The Aft buoyancy tank don't not look right to, I believe it should go to the top of the deck as it need to be able to vent.

You have to remember that all the tanks need a way to vent the air and water at the top and most are open directly to the sea at the bottom.
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: NZSnowman on 22 Jan , 2018, 10:35: Quote from: David83 on 22 Jan , 2018, 10:07
Dear Fillipo

Thats from Kagero 3D Booklet maybe it helps .

br David

David, great drawing!

It clearly show all the tanks and venting.

This summer in NZ I been working on the Saddle Tanks and is drawing clearly show all the key things with them :)
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: David83 on 22 Jan , 2018, 10:42: yes i hope i can help you in some things would be great to be a part of you fantastic 3D projekt NZ.

br David
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: David83 on 22 Jan , 2018, 10:46: close ups

br David
Title: Re: Stern structure outside pressure hull
Post by: bianco64squalo on 22 Jan , 2018, 12:15: Thanks Snowman for your patience, and thanks David for sharing new and useful drawings...
Iâ€™m waiting to receive the plans I ordered in Germany....