Author Topic: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing  (Read 516697 times)

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Offline Bob Tomlin

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1440 on: 30 Oct , 2016, 05:22 »
Hi Simon,


I'm in awe of your superdetailed schematics and these decks really look the part.


As someone who gets possibly a little too obsessed with details sometimes, I'd recently been delving into the world of non-slip stud patterns on the bow and stern plates (mainly on type IXs, but also type VIIs).
Looking at photographs, I'd pretty much convinced myself at one stage that the pattern on most boats was this one - not to scale - (I'm calling this Type A):-





With this pattern you can make equilateral hexagons out of the studs.
Am I right in thinking that my eyes are looking at this pattern in your schematics here Simon?


I realise that there's probably some variation with boats out of different shipyards, but just wanted to make sure you'd also seen the boats with this type of pattern - not to scale again - (which I'm calling type B):-





With this pattern, you can make square shapes within the studs.


I'm just mentioning it because as I said, for a while I was convinced that I was looking at pattern A in photos, because of the effects of perspective, when I was actually looking at 'B'.
For example, when looking from a low angle from the stern, my eyes were seeing the hexagons, but when I carried out a small experiment (yes it was becoming a sort of obsession), I realised it was the effect of perspective.


Of course it's very hard to tell properly in photos unless they are taken from almost a plan view of the deck and close enough to see the studs.
I have definitely got photos of the type B pattern on type VIIs but have not yet come across one that definitely shows a type A.
I'd be very interested if you've come across a photo that definitively shows a 'Type A' pattern though?
I've been looking for a close-up on the U-995 to see what that has, but not found one yet.


Cheers Bob.
















Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1441 on: 30 Oct , 2016, 12:05 »
Hi Showmann,


thanks again for sharing, amazing work!


I'am wondering if the metal plates of the wooden deck were coated with Alberich tiles (for example U 1105)?
If the plates were coated all the rivets had to be removed to get a smooth surface so the tiles could stick on the metal. What do you think?


Thanks in advance
falo

I don’t have any photo's that are clear enough to tell if the Alberich tiles are on the metal plates of the wooden deck, sorry. I will keep my eyes open for any evidence.

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1442 on: 30 Oct , 2016, 13:21 »
Hi Bob

Very interesting discussion.

It’s been a while since I did my non-slip stud patterns research. The first thing I noticed while doing my research was there are several different patterns of non-slip stud patterns. This difference is mostly seen between the plates from inside and outside the U-boat.
 
Of the ‘circular’ non-slip stud patterns, there are two style, Style A & B. From my research, I have found style A is virtually only the on bow and stern. Style B is mainly on the inside of the U-boat and on some of the metal deck hatches (but I believe style B has be put on some early Type VIIC’s bow and stern also).

Like you said, finding good photos to be 100% sure it’s very hard, however, I rechecked my photos again this morning, and with the evidence I have I am still confident that most Type VIIC’s used style A on their bow and stern.

I have very few photos of the Type IX, but I yet to see Style A on this boat, I have only seen Style B on the Type IX.

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1443 on: 30 Oct , 2016, 19:46 »
Hi Bob

Very interesting discussion.

It’s been a while since I did my non-slip stud patterns research. The first thing I noticed while doing my research was there are several different patterns of non-slip stud patterns. This difference is mostly seen between the plates from inside and outside the U-boat.
 
Of the ‘circular’ non-slip stud patterns, there are two style, Style A & B. From my research, I have found style A is virtually only the on bow and stern. Style B is mainly on the inside of the U-boat and on some of the metal deck hatches (but I believe style B has be put on some early Type VIIC’s bow and stern also).

Like you said, finding good photos to be 100% sure it’s very hard, however, I rechecked my photos again this morning, and with the evidence I have I am still confident that most Type VIIC’s used style A on their bow and stern.

I have very few photos of the Type IX, but I yet to see Style A on this boat, I have only seen Style B on the Type IX.

Thanks for the PM
 
I rechecked a third time all the photo's I have. The best photo I believe is from Tore while he was standing on the bow during a practice torpedo firing. In this photo there is strong evidence to suggest Style B.
 
However, I think the very best photo is found in the book by E. Wetzel on U-995 on page 91. Here a photo of U-338 is extremely clear and almost if not perpendicular to the camera. This photo clearly indicates Style B.
 
Looks like I will have to changed my non-slip stud patterns :'(
« Last Edit: 31 Oct , 2016, 00:24 by NZSnowman »

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1444 on: 30 Oct , 2016, 20:11 »
Port side wooden pole

Dougie, here my 3-D model of the large pole found on the port side of the boat.


This images has been resized. Click to view original image.


This images has been resized. Click to view original image.

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1445 on: 31 Oct , 2016, 00:23 »
Hi Bob

Here my new non-slip stud patterns (Upper section), Style A (lower). I also made the stud smaller, they are now 7.5 mm (D) by 3.0 mm (H); older ones were 10 mm (D) by 5 mm (H). What you think?


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Offline dougie47

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1446 on: 31 Oct , 2016, 15:20 »
Hi Simon,

Very nice on the wooden pole. For the early VIIC decks my estimate for the length of the wooden pole (both the one on the forward deck and the long one on the aft deck) was a length of 6 metres long.

The early boats also could have a shorter pole on the aft deck on the starboard side; my estimate for this one was 4 metres.

Going by the photo of U 1305 at commissioning, it is hard to tell but it looks like it might be the same length as 12 free-flooding vents? This would make it around 6 metres long.

Cheers,

Dougie

Offline Bob Tomlin

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1447 on: 31 Oct , 2016, 15:33 »
Hi Simon, sorry for the delay in getting back to you (stuck in work all day).
Thanks for having another look at the studs for me. Yes I find it quite difficult looking at the patterns in photos and trying to work it out with perspective (I certainly felt like my eyes were going 'dotty').
From what I could see on the bow of the U-995 in a photo, I thought the studs looked like pattern B also. Just seen a photo of pattern B on U-612 also (early boat).


The studs look great in your schematic too.
I am interested in what the spacings should be in 72nd scale. Revell have got the type B on their U-505 kit and look (to me) to have horizontal and vertical spacings at approx 1.2mm? (86.4mm if you scaled it up).


I would very much like to know if you do come across a clear example of a Type A in a photo sometime. If there was an industry standard it would make things a lot easier.


Great artwork as always.
Thanks and Cheers, Bob.









Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1448 on: 04 Nov , 2016, 22:25 »
The bow reserve torpedo container hatches


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Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1449 on: 05 Nov , 2016, 14:12 »
Just a remember to everyone, many of my 3-D models can be found at:

https://3dwarehouse.sketchup.com/collection.html?id=u4a2facb6-00be-441c-a5e5-ffd7a3c3549d

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1450 on: 05 Nov , 2016, 14:35 »
Rear jumping wire supports


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Update: I found a better wartime photo of the Rear jumping wire support frame. This photo corrected the position of this support frame compared to the Type VIIC’s plans and clearly indicated the methods of attachment for the internal support pole. This new model reflects the changes.


This images has been resized. Click to view original image.
« Last Edit: 29 Nov , 2016, 00:23 by NZSnowman »

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1451 on: 05 Nov , 2016, 20:05 »
Dougie, here C5 from the Accurate Model Parts 72-02 1/72nd Type VIIC U-Boat Deck & Floods Set (page 10)


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Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1452 on: 18 Nov , 2016, 00:02 »
Finding original German measurements for the Conning Tower is very rare. I have collected all the original measurement for the Conning Tower I have and prepared this plan for people.

Happy viewing :)


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PS. I also have a pdf of this if you would like it.

Offline Johann Vilthomsen

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1453 on: 21 Nov , 2016, 03:00 »
Thank You!!!!!  :D

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #1454 on: 26 Nov , 2016, 21:56 »
Have anyone got any photo's of the capstan?