Author Topic: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details  (Read 572705 times)

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Offline Don Prince

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3810 on: 24 Oct , 2017, 02:27 »

Hello Mr. Tore,


I have been reviewing pages 61 through page 63... See the attachment.


The lines above and external are used to test for when the RFO saddle tanks and internal tanks are full...


The hull section on the right shows the sampling of the internal bunker/tank 2 going to a bucket to measure the remaining fuel oil.  What I believe they are doing with the 3 other lines is testing for water when the tanks are empty; FBT 4 port and Stb and IB 2 (1 bucket with 4 lines).


The hull center section in the center shows the same setup for the internal fuel oil bunker/tank 1 for measuring the contents. They have another line going to a single bucket where they are testing for water when the IB 1 tank is empty (1 bucket 2 lines).


The hull center section - the lines at the top of R 1 port and stb go to a bucket, but I'm not sure why... They could open the lines going to the bucket to allow R 1 to vent while refueling, and monitor the long glass sight tube to know when to stop the pumping.


a) What is this bucket for and where is it located?
b) If the valves were shut going to the bucket, and the depot pumping continued for a few seconds. What kind of problem could result?

The meaning of Transfer, Delivery, and Venting...
c) The line in R 1 is pressurized when transferring fuel oil to another tank
d) The line in R 1 is pressurized when delivering fuel oil to the gravity/day tank to fuel the diesel engines.
e) The line in R 1 is venting when the tank is being refueled by a pumping station.

Are these the correct definitions for Transfer, Delivery, and Venting in this instance?


The hull section on left looks OK...  They can test the FRO 2 saddle tanks for water at the top when the tanks are empty.

One additional question... Were the collection funnels for fuel oil over-flow physically below the deck, or was there only the vent lines with shut-off valves? So the fuel oil depot station personnel carried the funnels on-board to drain the fuel oil over-board?

I really apologize for changing this post so many times - I'm finding out things as I go...
Regards,
Don_
« Last Edit: 25 Oct , 2017, 02:10 by Don Prince »
A man's got to know his limitations...
Harry Callahan, SFPD

Offline Don Prince

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3811 on: 24 Oct , 2017, 02:42 »
Hi Simon,


What is different from this?


Regards,
Don_
A man's got to know his limitations...
Harry Callahan, SFPD

Offline Don Prince

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3812 on: 24 Oct , 2017, 21:39 »
Hello Mr. Tore,


I solved one issue that was confusing me...  "Austritt Triebölmeßgefäß" = Outlet drive oil measuring vessel or "fuel oil measuring vessel", this is NOT an "Air Gauge" that I had labeled on Plan 8 and Plan 8a!!! I could not figure how to get it to work and measure fuel oil pressure...

I found "Austr Triebölmeßgefäß" in the Type IX plans and we had "Austr Meßgefäß" in the type VII C plans for the same device...


Regards,
Don_
« Last Edit: 24 Oct , 2017, 21:47 by Don Prince »
A man's got to know his limitations...
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Offline NZSnowman

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3813 on: 24 Oct , 2017, 21:42 »
Hello Mr. Tore,


I solved one issue that was confusing me...  "Austritt Triebölmeßgefäß" = Outlet drive oil measuring vessel or "fuel oil measuring vessel", this is NOT an "Air Gauge" that I had labeled on Plan 8 and Plan 8a!!! I could not figure how to get it to work and measure fuel oil pressure...


I found "Austr Triebölmeßgefäß" in the Type IX plans and we had "Austr Meßgefäß" in the type VII C plans for the same device...

Regards,
Don

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3814 on: 24 Oct , 2017, 21:47 »
Hi Simon,


What is different from this?


Regards,
Don_

This is a old drawing and there has been a few big updates of the Diesel Engine Exhaust system.

Offline Don Prince

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3815 on: 25 Oct , 2017, 21:16 »
Hello Mr. Tore,


I am still working on the  Plans 8 and 8a dealing with fuel oil testing and measurements.  I have ran across some inconsistencies between these plans.


Plan 8 shows a horizontal view of the fuel oil tanks with the various pipe connections and collection buckets, and we see 2 pipes going to the aft collection bucket and 4 pipes going to the forward collection bucket in the control room.  This drawing seems to agree with the many photos that I have on file.


Plan 8a shows a frontal slice view of the fuel oil tanks with the various pipe connections and the collection buckets, and we see 4 pipes going to the aft collection buckets and 4 pipes going to the forward collection bucket in the control room.


Obviously, Plan 8 and Plan 8a don't agree, so something looks to be very wrong! Plan 8a shows two pipes from the top of the R 1 regulating tanks port and starboard and then to a collection bucket. However, plan 7 shows the very same 2 air pipes from R 1 going to a muffler.


Therefore, I believe Plan 8a should be noted as being incorrect, or I could graphically make correction to the drawing... I have attached the 3 plan drawings... What do you think?


Regards,
Don_
A man's got to know his limitations...
Harry Callahan, SFPD

Offline Don Prince

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3816 on: 25 Oct , 2017, 22:22 »
Hello Mr. Tore,


What do you think of this change?


Regards,
Don_
« Last Edit: 26 Oct , 2017, 00:43 by Don Prince »
A man's got to know his limitations...
Harry Callahan, SFPD

Offline Don Prince

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3817 on: 29 Oct , 2017, 20:49 »
Hello Mr. Tore,


I changed the attached photo because I had the vent valve labeled incorrectly as the MBT 3 Vent...  It's too high to be MBT 3's vent valve. I also have a question about the pipes for exhaust blowing MBT 3. Do the piped from the exhaust blowing manifold enter the upper pressure hull area and then extend down to MBT 3? If so, then would these pipes be wrapped with an insulation in the control room?


Answer to my question - I found in Simon's layered drawing that the MBT 3 blowing pipes are attached to the side of the round casing to the MBT 3 vent valve...  Good work Simon!


Regards,
Don_
« Last Edit: 30 Oct , 2017, 02:37 by Don Prince »
A man's got to know his limitations...
Harry Callahan, SFPD

Offline Don Prince

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3818 on: 05 Nov , 2017, 02:30 »
Hello Mr. Tore,


Have you and the wife made it back from the farm to the city? Things have been quiet on the website... I just wanted to make sure that you all are OK!


Regards,
Don_
« Last Edit: 05 Nov , 2017, 13:52 by Don Prince »
A man's got to know his limitations...
Harry Callahan, SFPD

Offline Don Prince

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3819 on: 20 Nov , 2017, 02:59 »
Hello Mr. Tore,


I have updated the Bow Hydroplane drawing on page 195...  I know that I shouldn't let my mind wonder! But, If the Bow hydroplane operator in the control room had to switch to manual controls, then the clutch on the spindle is engaged with the manual drive gear.


Later after a repair is made, then the electric motor clutch may be engaged again.  However, there is the location of the resistive network which is driven by the motor shaft and may not indicate the correct hydroplane angle.  It is not likely that the clutch will be engaged at the previous hydroplane angle when it was dis-engaged...


How do they reset the bow hydroplane angle to match the mechanical angle indicators?  I'm thinking it has to be done at the resistive network unit because it needs to reflect the present hydroplane angle...


Regards,
Don_


PS - At NCR (National Cash Register) we had a punch mark to align timing gears on mechanical registers. They could bring the hydroplaned to indicate 0° on the mechanical indicators and then un-mesh the Resistive Unit and get it back into time with the hydroplanes where the electric indicator now reads 0°?
« Last Edit: 20 Nov , 2017, 09:53 by Don Prince »
A man's got to know his limitations...
Harry Callahan, SFPD

Offline Don Prince

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3820 on: 20 Nov , 2017, 03:49 »
Hello Mr. Tore,


I believe the answer to the Hydroplane timing issue may be very simple...  After engaging the hydroplane drive motor clutch - The resistive unit may have hard internal end stops and a slip drive clutch; where the hydroplane operator sets the hydroplane to a hard full up, and then to a hard full down. That should time the resistive unit with the hydroplanes again.  At least that's the way I would do it...  What do you think?


Regards,
Don_
« Last Edit: 20 Nov , 2017, 03:57 by Don Prince »
A man's got to know his limitations...
Harry Callahan, SFPD

Offline Don Prince

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3821 on: 30 Nov , 2017, 00:30 »
Hello Mr. Tore and all,


I have uploaded the latest version of Skizzenbuch into my Dropbox folder. I have verified to the best of my ability about 2/3rds of the book and updated the torpedo section with new material.  Maciek was the expert in this area, and I believe he would be proud of his student's efforts...


Regards,
Don_
A man's got to know his limitations...
Harry Callahan, SFPD

Offline bianco64squalo

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3822 on: 30 Nov , 2017, 23:21 »
Hi Mr. Don,
when do you think that the materials you are collecting and producing will be available for all U-Boat enthusiasts ?
I try to collect the crumbs of your fantastic work from the various threads of the forums, but I'll look in advance for the complete work...
Thanks anyway for your research....
Filippo

Offline Don Prince

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3823 on: 03 Dec , 2017, 12:29 »
Hi Filippo,


I sent an email to the Naval Institute Press yesterday evening and I believe I should receive a reply on Monday or perhaps Tuesday... Things have been dragging-out with these publishers; they seem never to have any priority when it comes to books. I will post more info later.


Regards,
Don_
A man's got to know his limitations...
Harry Callahan, SFPD

Offline Don Prince

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Re: Tores mailbox VIIC and VIIC/41 operation and technical details
« Reply #3824 on: 09 Dec , 2017, 01:09 »
Hello All,


I did get a response from the Naval Institute Press as follows:


Don,
 
We are still reviewing the work. The length does present a challenge but we’re not sure two volumes is the best solution. Will be back to you when we have a final decision.
 
Best regards,
Paul
 
Paul Merzlak
Editorial Director
Naval Institute Press
U.S. Naval Institute
291 Wood Road
Annapolis, MD  21402


So, we'll see what happens....
Regards,
Don_
« Last Edit: 09 Dec , 2017, 01:11 by Don Prince »
A man's got to know his limitations...
Harry Callahan, SFPD