VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing

[NZSnowman]

I am not to sure about a foot/hand hold , it seem to be in a funny position but what would be a good position. I will check all my books and pictures over the next couple of days and see if I found anything.

I had imagine a foot/hand hold would be smaller like on the Gatos and I would think if a Type VII

[NZSnowman]

Interesting point, NZ, but then, the Germans were looking at a lot of almost sci-fi stuff, maybe it wasn't very secret. I think it's also ironic that the Metox lead Allies directly to it!

Yes lots of talk about secret sci-fi stuff!! Herbert talks a lot about a 'Secret Dead Ray' 

I have been doing a lot reading about Metox and I think the new thought about it is.

Yes the Metox did emitted a weak signal and the Allies could detection this sign. However, it now believe that the signal was so weak that it could not be used to track U-Boats. About this time the Allies started to hear rumor that the Germans were starting to think that the Allies were homing into the Metox. So the Allies started a rumor that they could detection the Metox sign. I think they did this by telling Bombing crews, know that a few of them would be shot down over Germany. As soon the Germans hear that Allies could detection the Metox sign they toll all U-boat to stop using them. This was just what the Allies wanted. Now the Allies could used there radar with good results.

Clever! Intrigue! Like the "man who never was" - Brits put fake invasion plans on a dead body, dumped in the ocean with plane debris, and let it be discovered in Spain. Great triple twists!

That's an interesting story about the Metoz and the bomber crews Snowman.  What year was that happening and was it ALL Allied bomber crews or just the ones of one nation?

I've been tossing around the idea of writing a book about what I know of my father's war, and it might be something that he was involved in.  He was shot down in Feb '44, over Germany and as a Pathfinder, he would have been involved in radar and radar detection and electronic navigation (Oboe) before it was common among the RAF crews.

Doenitz ordered all U-boats to cause using the Metox on 31 July 1943, So the Brits, may have started the rumor a month or a few weeks before this. Maybe the started rumor with several SOE (Special Operations Executive) members going to a flying crew bar and going around starting this rumor knowing that the SS or Gestapo would end up with the information if they crash. Or maybe they crash a plane into France and made it look like it could track Metox signals I just not sure how they started the rumor. Maybe, in the next 20 years they may release a document with all the secret in it

Here are little more information (and maybe correct) about the Metox that lead Allies directly to it. I just read this in Black May: Allies Defeat of German U-Boats

The Naxos-U replaced an interim G.S.R. call Hagenuk-Wellenzeiger, or Wanze, the sole virtue of which was that it emitted low levels of radiation. Discovering that the old Metox emitted high levels, BdU feared that Allied aircraft were homing on these emission. It was confirmed in that fear when a RAF prisoner at the German interrogation center Oberursal told his questioners that that was the means used by Coastal aircraft to find U-Boats. Thought untrue, the POW's lie and the resulting 'radiation scare' caused D

[Greif]

Hi Simon, it was true that Metox emissions acting as a homing device for aircraft to zero in on uboats.  As an aside, RAF Bomber Command had a radar warning reciever called "Monica" that did exactly the same thing, allowing German nightfighters to home in on it's emissions.  Radar was new technology during WWII, and alot was not understood about it's capabilities and vunerabilities.  The allies did a much better job unraveling radar's mysteries then the Germans during the war and were thus able to get alot more effective use from radar.

Ernest

[NZSnowman]

Thanks Ernest for formation! I do not know about the RAF Bomber Command system "Monica", I will have a search on the net for it 

[Pat]

I am not to sure about a foot/hand hold , it seem to be in a funny position but what would be a good position. I will check all my books and pictures over the next couple of days and see if I found anything.

I had imagine a foot/hand hold would be smaller like on the Gatos and I would think if a Type VII

[Mr. Bill]

Hello!

I think the Type IX boats had foot/hand holes similar to the Gatos.  These are seen in many photos of various IX boats such as this:



Look just beneath the feet of the crewman on the gangplank.

Cheers,

Bill

[Mr. Bill]

Hello Again!

This photo might help demonstrate what I mentioned in a previous post about the stanchions.  It shows U-90 with all of the harbour railings/stanchions in place (probably commissioning day).  The single raised vent is located immediately below the two closely spaced stanchions.  These type of stanchions are commonly used at boarding locations which lead me to think the vent was a foot / hand hole used to board at this location. 



I suppose this vent could have a different purpose, but it seems like a foot / hand hole.  Could it be something else?

Cheers,

Bill

[NZSnowman]

Hi Bill

Its look like you are right. Its does look like a foot hole! I checked serveral of my plans and there seen nothing under the deck that needs an extra flood hole.

[NZSnowman]

A update of the Blowing of exhaust gases piping system for the ballast tanks.


Fig. 1. The old drawing base on The Type VII U-Boat by David Westwood.


Fig. 2. New drawing base on war time photographs.

[NZSnowman]

Finish my new house on Monday and started moving in yesterdays. Finally now able to start setting up my office and computers. Having lots of fun now with the drawing. Still have to either buy or make myself a nice computer desk and unpack all my u-boat books.   

[NZSnowman]

Hi Dougie

While doing your research for your 'Type VII Free-Flooding Vent Patterns' did you come across any real measurement for the size of the flood holes?

[Rokket]

nice to get settled!

[dougie47]

Hi Simon,

Nice to see you are getting settled in your new home. I think I wrote the original version of the vents pattern article about six years ago. It was written specifically with modellers of the (then) new Revell 1/72nd VIIC. At the time nobody other than myself seemed too bothered about the vent patterns. So I stuck to researching the patterns rather than the holes themselves.

Therefore I haven't actually measured the holes themselves. I would guess though, with multiple yards making the boats, that there might be some variations in the sizes between batches?

It is great to see talented researchers such as yourself who are studying the Type VIIC in real detail. Keep up the good work!

Cheers,

Dougie 

[NZSnowman]

Thanks for the information Dougie.

I really been enjoy the research side of my drawing!!! I have learn some much over the last 2 years while doing this drawing. I feel I could now name all the pipes in the engine room

I think you are right about variations in the sizes between batches and likely even ship yards. At lase I have a great base to work from, as I know that the framing are space 500mm apart in this area. There would only be

[NZSnowman]

Stern Flood Holes

Using an very clear and good photo, I was able to get a very good measurement of the stern Flood holes. I belive they are 400mm long and 120mm high (5.6mm x 1.7mm at 1:72 scale). I also workout the height between the double Flood Holes at 250mm (3.5mm).