Author Topic: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing  (Read 512131 times)

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Offline Pat

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #330 on: 31 Jan , 2010, 11:34 »
Snowman, I don't know what the holes are, but one of them probably somehow does work for depth.  Extremely unlikely to be for speed though.

A depth guage would work by letting water into a tube wich would somehow move a float or liquid in a calibrated tube.  Not sure how this happens since any sight tube made of glass would break if the pressure got to be too much.  However, at 200 meters, I think the pressure would be approx 300 psi, and maybe glass can take that if it's thick enough.  (1 atmos = 14 psi    every 30 ft in depth adds another atmos  1 meter = 39"          so 200m = 7800" divided by 12 = 650 feet divided by 30 = 21 atmospheres times 14 psi = 303 psi)

The way a boats speeometer works in most cases is that there's a small paddlewheel in a little depression in the side of the hull, in an area where the flow of water is not disturbed by propellers or rudders.  (or dive planes)  The paddles stick out only a fraction of an inch into the flow, but enough that the passing water spins it.

One of the paddles has a small magnet on it and every revolution, the magnet passes another magnet on the inside of the hull and causes it to register.  The number of turns per second gives you the speed.

There's also some speedometers that work somewhat like an aircraft pitot tube, but that requires a hole in the very bow of the boat facing forward.  The holes you show are on the side.

There will also be holes somewhere near the engine room since the diesels would be water-cooled.  Even with a radiator, (which is typical of salt-water boats) the heat has to go somewhere.  This is done by raw sea water going through a heat-exchanger at the radiator, and the raw water gets ejected mixed with the diesel exhaust to cool the muffler and exhaust pipes as well, while the radiator coolant is kept in a closed system with the engine itself.

Usually the raw water intake hole will look like a small blister on the side of the boat with holes in it to strain out any seaweed or marine organisms.

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #331 on: 31 Jan , 2010, 12:16 »
While read your reply I just remember seeing something similar on a Type XXI plan, I checked it out.

Pat, I think you are heading in right direction with the holes....On the Type XXI plan were are three small holes in the identical line, size and position on the U-boat (Starboard only and opponent the control station). On this plan they are label
« Last Edit: 31 Jan , 2010, 12:22 by NZSnowman »

Offline Pat

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #332 on: 31 Jan , 2010, 15:35 »
Snowman, that hole you point out on the side of the hull is almost definitely raw seawater inlet for the engines.  That's the same style that is used on ships today and it's in the right location and seems about the right size that I'd expect for that size diesel.

Probably there is also one on the other side for the port engine, although they could use just one.

BTW, the paddle wheel for the speedometer doesn't need to be large.  The entire thing may be no more than about an inch or two at the most in diameter, aand a little less deep since it needs perhaps 1/8" or 1/4" sticking out.

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #333 on: 31 Jan , 2010, 20:06 »
I know the inlet and and valve are at the right location! ;D As the opening is at 24,800 mm from the stern and 2,100 mm above the keel. This match the inside valve, right on!!

Also you right there is also a inlet opening on the Port side of the boat.

Thanks for the information about the paddle wheel for the speedometer. I will have a look at my pictures and I hope I can find it.

Offline Pat

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #334 on: 01 Feb , 2010, 07:01 »
Unfortunately, there's no sort of standard location where the paddlewheel might be, other than at least far enough under water that it won't be affected by wave action.

They mostly seem to be near the keel, but I've seen them higher up.  Lengthwise, they could be anywhere from near the bow (far enough back not to be affected by plunging into the waves) to just before they'd get interference from the propellers and rudders.

The one thing to think of is that they will be in a somewhat protected place, so that they don't get damaged by rubbing up against docks or fenders.

They're often a differnt colour than the hull, since they can't be painted with anti-fouling paint because that might throw them off.


Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #335 on: 01 Feb , 2010, 11:09 »
Thanks again for the information. My initial search was very narrow area of the pressure hull. I will widen my search of the hull  :)

Offline Pat

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #336 on: 01 Feb , 2010, 14:46 »
Another question.

What are the rectangular patches in the saddle tank just above and to the right of the raw water inlet?  I know the water goes in via a square grill further forward, but those patches have me babbled.  They don't seem to open up.

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #337 on: 01 Feb , 2010, 17:25 »
Another question.

What are the rectangular patches in the saddle tank just above and to the right of the raw water inlet?  I know the water goes in via a square grill further forward, but those patches have me babbled.  They don't seem to open up.

They are the water intake for the Saddle tanks :)  Check out a working drawing from U-570 (Lower middle picture) http://www.uboatarchive.net/U-570Plate28.htm

Offline SnakeDoc

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #338 on: 05 Feb , 2010, 04:02 »
Hello Snowman

I've got question - what did you pattern after, when you were drawing torpedo tubes installations (pipes, rods etc)?

Offline Pat

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #339 on: 05 Feb , 2010, 06:32 »
Snowman, I had another look at your photo of Jan 31, showing the raw seawater cooling inlet, and there's a small bump just above the inlet.  I wonder if that's the paddlewheel opening, just covered over for preservation reasons?  It looks possibly about the right size, and appears to project about the right amount.

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #340 on: 05 Feb , 2010, 11:16 »
Hello Snowman

I've got question - what did you pattern after, when you were drawing torpedo tubes installations (pipes, rods etc)?

The first time I drawn the torpedo tubes installations it was base on Anatomy of the ship - The Type VII U-Boat by David Westwood, a few original pictures taken during the war and pictures from U-995. It not very detail but it was the best I could do that the time.

I am planning to completely redraw the whole bow torpedo section & torpedo tubes, as over the last year or so I have collection some great pictures, plans and things. I think the next drawing should be a heap more detail. I am sure it will show all the pipes and working parts  ;D

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #341 on: 05 Feb , 2010, 11:55 »
Snowman, I had another look at your photo of Jan 31, showing the raw seawater cooling inlet, and there's a small bump just above the inlet.  I wonder if that's the paddlewheel opening, just covered over for preservation reasons?  It looks possibly about the right size, and appears to project about the right amount.

Hi Pat, It could be the opening for the paddle-wheel......but to tell you the truth I have no idea that a paddle-wheel for a speedometer look like :(. I just been looking for something different on the hull. However, I have been looking for something a lot smaller.
Below are the best pictures I have of this area. One is of the outside of the hull and the other is from the inside. I am almost sure that those pipes and fixer are the fixer from the other side. Does this look like a speedometer system ??? 

I have two other questions for you; Would you put the paddle-wheel so near to a inlet ??? Also would you put the paddle-wheel in the Engine Room or Control Room section ???



Pictures from U-995 http://www.uboataces.com/u995.shtml

Offline SnakeDoc

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #342 on: 05 Feb , 2010, 12:35 »
The first time I drawn the torpedo tubes installations it was base on Anatomy of the ship - The Type VII U-Boat by David Westwood, a few original pictures taken during the war and pictures from U-995. It not very detail but it was the best I could do that the time.

I have seen this picture - it's the best drawing I have seen till now (unfortunately, I didn't have seen many of them). The same is
in Urlich Gabler's "Submarine Design", and I think that the latter is more correct subtitled.

Quote from: NZSnowman
I am planning to completely redraw the whole bow torpedo section & torpedo tubes, as over the last year or so I have collection some great pictures, plans and things. I think the next drawing should be a heap more detail. I am sure it will show all the pipes and working parts  ;D

I'm specially interested in the interolocking and firing rod details. Is it possible that you would share some of these details before your work will complete?

--
Regards
Maciek

Offline Pat

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #343 on: 05 Feb , 2010, 14:48 »
Ok, on looking at the closeup snowman, it doesn

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: VIIC/41 - Schematices drawing
« Reply #344 on: 05 Feb , 2010, 19:35 »
The first time I drawn the torpedo tubes installations it was base on Anatomy of the ship - The Type VII U-Boat by David Westwood, a few original pictures taken during the war and pictures from U-995. It not very detail but it was the best I could do that the time.

I have seen this picture - it's the best drawing I have seen till now (unfortunately, I didn't have seen many of them). The same is
in Urlich Gabler's "Submarine Design", and I think that the latter is more correct subtitled.

Quote from: NZSnowman
I am planning to completely redraw the whole bow torpedo section & torpedo tubes, as over the last year or so I have collection some great pictures, plans and things. I think the next drawing should be a heap more detail. I am sure it will show all the pipes and working parts  ;D

I'm specially interested in the interolocking and firing rod details. Is it possible that you would share some of these details before your work will complete?

--
Regards
Maciek

Happy to post any pictures of the new drawing, unsure when I will start them, but they are a area I am keen to redraw.

Had you check out these pages, they maybe useful.

(These 3 pages have be translated in to English)

http://66.163.168.225/babelfish/translate_url_content?.intl=us&lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.u-historia.com%2fuhistoria%2ftecnico%2fvisitaguiada%2ftzr%2ftzr.htm
http://66.163.168.225/babelfish/translate_url_content?.intl=us&lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.u-historia.com%2fuhistoria%2ftecnico%2fvisitaguiada%2fproa%2fproa.htm
http://66.163.168.225/babelfish/translate_url_content?.intl=us&lp=es_en&trurl=http%3a%2f%2fwww.u-historia.com%2fuhistoria%2ftecnico%2fvisitaguiada%2fpopa%2fpopa.htm

http://www.uboatarchive.net/U-570Plate25.htm