Author Topic: German Torpedo Color?  (Read 47725 times)

0 Members and 2 Guests are viewing this topic.

Scorcher2

  • Guest
German Torpedo Color?
« on: 21 Jun , 2010, 16:19 »
Greetings!

I have purchased the White Ensign resin torpedo set G7A & G7E.   I am planning on using one of these displayed on the base I have my nearly completed U-557 on.   I would like someone to please tell me what color the torpedo should be.   I have a color photo of all metal finish in a museum and have seen color line drawings with the torpedo in various finishes.   And knowing the Kriegsmarine's regulations regarding painting I am sure there wouldn't be too much variance on whatever finish they had.  ::)

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

Offline NZSnowman

  • Admiral4
  • *
  • Posts: 2,263
  • Gender: Male
  • U-1308
    • U-1308 - Wikipedia
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #1 on: 21 Jun , 2010, 17:22 »
I believe the only colour they painted were Red & white on the warhead to show it was a training torpedo. Here are the true colour I believe, and the colours I am currently using for my drawing.



G7a/T1
Range/Speed: 6 km/44 knots, 8 km/40 knots, and 14 km/30 knots.
Guidance system: Straight running unguided design

G7e/T3
Range/Speed: 5 km/30 knots.
Guidance system: Straight running unguided design

G7e/T3
« Last Edit: 22 Jun , 2010, 00:51 by NZSnowman »

Scorcher2

  • Guest
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #2 on: 21 Jun , 2010, 22:05 »
Thank you for the very prompt and informative reply.   Now I can finally finish this project!

Thanks again.

Offline Rokket

  • Administrator
  • *
  • Posts: 2,289
  • Gender: Male
  • Submarine Enthusiast
    • AMP - Accurate Model Parts
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #3 on: 25 Jun , 2010, 20:04 »
Dougie would know, but I'm sure they were a green (pale yellowyish) nose and polished steel body, brass fins and props.
AMP - Accurate Model Parts - http://amp.rokket.biz

Offline Pat

  • Captain
  • *
  • Posts: 395
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #4 on: 26 Jun , 2010, 06:42 »
Why not write or email to either the Chicago Museum of Technology, USA (Where U-505 is located) or theKriegsmarine Museum at Laboe, Germany (where U-995 is) and ask?  (Or even the Greenwich or Portsmouth Naval Museums in England?)

I've written to Chicago and Greenwich before and they were quite helpful and prompt in replying.  Museum curators usually are quite happy when people show an interest in what they're doing, especially in writing.  It probably at the least helps them justify their budgets.

As somebody who was in the artillery, I'd be very surprised if torpedos weren't different colours depending on the type of torpedo.  In the artillery we had shells with blue warheads (training), olive green (HE), red (armour piercing) etc.  It would seem logical the the Kriegsmarine would have had different colours for different types such as the steam or battery driven, the magnetic ones, the ones that zigzagged, etc. 

It makes sense to ensure that the crew doesn't load the wrong type and when the emergency lighting is on during a depth charge attack it would be even more important to be able to tell types of torpedos apart.


Offline NZSnowman

  • Admiral4
  • *
  • Posts: 2,263
  • Gender: Male
  • U-1308
    • U-1308 - Wikipedia
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #5 on: 28 Sep , 2010, 14:41 »
Dougie would know, but I'm sure they were a green (pale yellowyish) nose and polished steel body, brass fins and props.

I think the 'green (pale yellowyish)' colour is commonly mistake for the torpedo grease they used in very large amounts on the torpedoes, but I could be wrong myself ;D
« Last Edit: 21 Jan , 2011, 13:33 by NZSnowman »

Offline Natter

  • Lt Cdr
  • *
  • Posts: 111
  • Gender: Male
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #6 on: 06 Dec , 2011, 13:20 »
I believe the only colour they painted were Red & white on the warhead to show it was a training torpedo. Here are the true colour I believe, and the colours I am currently using for my drawing.
Not entirely true I'm afraid...
I have just posted a comment on the colours in another thread ( http://models.rokket.biz/index.php?action=profile;u=388;sa=showPosts ).

Some details on the T1 apart, the illustration isn't that bad. The different colour for the aft-section (and the water-chamber on the T1) is wrong though (it should all be unpainted steel).
The yellow colour on the T1 war-head is presumably meant to indicate bronze, as certain Kb heads manufactured from bronze would have been unpainted. The rest of the heads shows a pretty accurate colour though.

Offline Natter

  • Lt Cdr
  • *
  • Posts: 111
  • Gender: Male
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #7 on: 06 Dec , 2011, 13:29 »
Why not write or email to either the Chicago Museum of Technology, USA (Where U-505 is located) or theKriegsmarine Museum at Laboe, Germany (where U-995 is) and ask?  (Or even the Greenwich or Portsmouth Naval Museums in England?)
Sadly, most museums doesn't seem to have a clue... (both the U-505 and the U-995 displays show torpedoes with wrong colours :-| ).

As somebody who was in the artillery, I'd be very surprised if torpedos weren't different colours depending on the type of torpedo.  In the artillery we had shells with blue warheads (training), olive green (HE), red (armour piercing) etc.  It would seem logical the the Kriegsmarine would have had different colours for different types such as the steam or battery driven, the magnetic ones, the ones that zigzagged, etc.
They didn't. I don't have my documents at hand, but if I find time later on I might put up a list of the german torpedo/warhead/pistol combinations. All steel heads were painted light (or dark) grey, and some bronzeheads wre unpainted.

Comparing artilleryshells and torpedoes are a bit far off... You can't accidentaly load the wrong type in a tube onboard a submarine :-)  Submarines usually had one type of torpedo (or two if they also kept the G7a), depending on the type of submarine and the timeline of the war. There were in fact not that many operational types of torpedo: Only G7a (wet-heater) and G7e (electric). However, there were variants of both and especially many different types of pistols (mechanical, magnectic) - hence the list of combinations mentioned above.

Offline Natter

  • Lt Cdr
  • *
  • Posts: 111
  • Gender: Male
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #8 on: 06 Dec , 2011, 13:34 »
I think the 'green (pale yellowyish)' colour is commonly mistake for the torpedo grease they used in very large amounts on the torpedoes
The grease would rather give a brown-tint on the torpedo. Mu best tip on the green "myth" is that many deduct this from the fact that US WW2-torpedoes where green ( a result of the "parkerizing" process - similar to the bluening of handguns etc.). Also, post-war practice show usage of paint to prevent corrosion on torpedoes (royal navy typically used green and bundesmarine used blue colours).

Offline Natter

  • Lt Cdr
  • *
  • Posts: 111
  • Gender: Male
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #9 on: 06 Dec , 2011, 13:36 »
brass fins and props.
Brass were used extensivly on the G7a (the only "visible" brass parts would have been the propellers though), but as rawmaterials became sparse during the war, this was replaced by steel. The G7e had very few parts of brass.

Offline NZSnowman

  • Admiral4
  • *
  • Posts: 2,263
  • Gender: Male
  • U-1308
    • U-1308 - Wikipedia
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #10 on: 06 Dec , 2011, 17:20 »
Thanks Natter, for the information!! I will update my drawings with the new colours. I have been collecting data on the Torpedoes, and was hoping to do a big update next summer on them.

Do you have pictures or additional information on the painting on the rudder to identify LUT II?

How the new colours, for the G7a/T1?


(Scale: 1 pixels = 11.94 mm)

Offline Natter

  • Lt Cdr
  • *
  • Posts: 111
  • Gender: Male
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #11 on: 08 Dec , 2011, 15:33 »
Do you have pictures or additional information on the painting on the rudder to identify LUT II?
G7a (T1) LUt II: 100mm high green text "L II" on both sides of aft-section + green band on rudder.
G7e (T3a) LUT II: 100mm high green text "L II" on both sides of aft-section + 45mm wide green band on rudder.

See also attached drawing from the german LUT II manual.


How the new colours, for the G7a/T1?
The colour on the head looks more like bronze than the previous one (there were both painted and unpainted bronze- and steelheads though, but those painted were light grey). For the body it is more correct (unpainted steel). This goes for the G7e torpedoes as well. See also other comments on the attached drawings.

I have also added some info from german manuals describing the LUT I markings for the T3 torpedo, as well as the different markings for T1 torpedoes indicating if the torpedo had starting gear and/or a strenghtened engine installed.

I know they had several other markings (coloured stripes on the aft-section indicating different versions of the G7e), but so far I haven't been able to track down descriptions of these.

Most torpedoes also had two painted stripes on the airtank (G7a) / batterycompartment (G7e) indicating the center of gravity for an "empty" torpedo without head (see example from attached photo).
« Last Edit: 08 Dec , 2011, 15:35 by Natter »

Offline NZSnowman

  • Admiral4
  • *
  • Posts: 2,263
  • Gender: Male
  • U-1308
    • U-1308 - Wikipedia
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #12 on: 10 Dec , 2011, 02:09 »
Hi Natter

Once again a big thanks for your help and the additional information! It

Offline Natter

  • Lt Cdr
  • *
  • Posts: 111
  • Gender: Male
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #13 on: 10 Dec , 2011, 06:01 »

Offline NZSnowman

  • Admiral4
  • *
  • Posts: 2,263
  • Gender: Male
  • U-1308
    • U-1308 - Wikipedia
Re: German Torpedo Color?
« Reply #14 on: 10 Dec , 2011, 21:39 »
Natter, I was wondering if you know if there any external different between the T5 G7es Zaunk