Author Topic: AMP7202 1/72nd Type VIIC deck and floods PE set  (Read 3156 times)

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Offline NZSnowman

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Re: AMP7202 1/72nd Type VIIC deck and floods PE set
« Reply #15 on: 26 Oct , 2016, 12:57 »
When I tried to estimate the plank width and slot width on the slotted decks using loads of photos I came up with 75.2mm for plank width and 24.2mm for the slot width. They would have used whole numbers so my estimate for the slotted deck is a plank width of 75mm and a slot width of 25mm between planks. Can I ask what the exact plank width you have gone with is? Does the planked deck have completely different measurements, perhaps with a wider plank?

I estimated the plank width and slot width for the ‘Planked Deck U-boat’ as 100 mm and 10 mm.


I've always thought of the pole being wood as there are two colour photos showing the pole being wooden in colour (not covered by black wood preservative). I suspect that on quite a few boats the pole on the deck was covered with the black wood preservative during refits. I suppose the pole could have been hollow metal on some boats depending on the materials at hand.

Thanks, I will make my pole of wood  :)


I would be happy to look through photos. I know where the big hatch was for loading torpedoes into the stern torpedo room. What I am not too sure on is exactly where the hatch for the aft reserve torpedo container was. Can you let me know?

It’s the long (5500 mm) hatch (Green) directly behind the loading torpedoes hatch (Red).


Offline dougie47

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Re: AMP7202 1/72nd Type VIIC deck and floods PE set
« Reply #16 on: 26 Oct , 2016, 16:39 »
Hi Simon,

I've had a look through my photos but unfortunately I can't tell if they covered up the aft container hatch. Annoyingly there are crewmen standing over this part of the deck and I can't see it properly. But I would guess you are right that the very late VIICs and VIIC/41s such as U 250 were buildwith no aft container hatch. There was no opportunity to change to spare torpedoes due to Allied air cover so this makes sense. Sorry I can't provide evidence for you.

In regard to the plank width I have looked at this for the first time tonight for the planked deck. You are right, there are differences. All the early boats with the planked deck had the same number of planks as the slotted deck (as mentioned my estimate is 100mm for the width of both the plank plus the space between). But the very late VIICs and VIIC/41s such as U 250 have fewer planks (with the planks themselves being wider). Here are some quick figures I noted down (these are the number of planks across the deck at various locations) -

Around the position where the 88mm would be - slotted (38 planks); early planked (38 planks); late planked (32 planks).
Around the ammo hatch directly behind the tower - slotted (26 planks); early planked (26 planks); late planked (22 planks).
Around the bollards on front deck - slotted (20 planks); early planked (20 planks); late planked (16 planks).
Around tripods on aft deck - slotted (20 planks); early planked (? planks); late planked (18 planks).

This isn't a proper study but enough to think that there were at least two different plank widths on planked decks. The first would be the same number of planks as on the slotted deck. The second would be on much later boats such as U 250 which had wider planks (and so fewer planks were needed).

At a very quick guess I'm thinking that on the very late boats such as U 250 the width of both the plank and the space between the plank added up to 120mm (since 38 / 32 = nearly 1.2). I haven't really looked at what the breakdown would be, perhaps 100mm for the plank and 20mm for the space (?) but I haven't tried to estimate this properly. However, your estimate of 100mm and 10mm might well be right and better than my own quick look at the matter.

Cheers,

Dougie

 

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: AMP7202 1/72nd Type VIIC deck and floods PE set
« Reply #17 on: 26 Oct , 2016, 17:51 »
In regard to the plank width I have looked at this for the first time tonight for the planked deck. You are right, there are differences. All the early boats with the planked deck had the same number of planks as the slotted deck (as mentioned my estimate is 100mm for the width of both the plank plus the space between). But the very late VIICs and VIIC/41s such as U 250 have fewer planks (with the planks themselves being wider). Here are some quick figures I noted down (these are the number of planks across the deck at various locations) -

Around the position where the 88mm would be - slotted (38 planks); early planked (38 planks); late planked (32 planks).
Around the ammo hatch directly behind the tower - slotted (26 planks); early planked (26 planks); late planked (22 planks).
Around the bollards on front deck - slotted (20 planks); early planked (20 planks); late planked (16 planks).
Around tripods on aft deck - slotted (20 planks); early planked (? planks); late planked (18 planks).

This isn't a proper study but enough to think that there were at least two different plank widths on planked decks. The first would be the same number of planks as on the slotted deck. The second would be on much later boats such as U 250 which had wider planks (and so fewer planks were needed).

At a very quick guess I'm thinking that on the very late boats such as U 250 the width of both the plank and the space between the plank added up to 120mm (since 38 / 32 = nearly 1.2). I haven't really looked at what the breakdown would be, perhaps 100mm for the plank and 20mm for the space (?) but I haven't tried to estimate this properly. However, your estimate of 100mm and 10mm might well be right and better than my own quick look at the matter.

I realised very early on there was variation in the planks width in the late planked boats. My gut feeling is the boatyards were using whatever they could get hold off during the end of the war. Therefore, I believe there’s variation, but with a tendency to have wider planks nearing the end of the war. I chosen 10 mm over 20 mm as I initially thought it look too large of a gap between the board’s. But now after relooking at a late boats I believe 20 mm is more correct than the 10 mm gap.

I believe U-826 (Launched 9 Mar 1944) had 100 mm / 20 mm and U-1020 (Launched 22 Mar 1944) had 80 mm / 20 mm. This is the variation in the planks wide cause by boatyards get hold off any size timber near the end of the war.
 
I going to redo all my wooden deck with the 20 mm gap, is will take me about +20 hours to fixes :'(


I've had a look through my photos but unfortunately I can't tell if they covered up the aft container hatch. Annoyingly there are crewmen standing over this part of the deck and I can't see it properly. But I would guess you are right that the very late VIICs and VIIC/41s such as U 250 were buildwith no aft container hatch. There was no opportunity to change to spare torpedoes due to Allied air cover so this makes sense. Sorry I can't provide evidence for you.

I had the same problems in a few of my photo's also. :D

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: AMP7202 1/72nd Type VIIC deck and floods PE set
« Reply #18 on: 26 Oct , 2016, 19:09 »
I going to redo all my wooden deck with the 20 mm gap, is will take me about +20 hours to fixes :'(

Some early modelling with the 20 mm gap look great  :)

Offline dougie47

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Re: AMP7202 1/72nd Type VIIC deck and floods PE set
« Reply #19 on: 28 Oct , 2016, 13:50 »
Hi Simon,

That's great, hope the deck design goes well.

Cheers,

Dougie

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: AMP7202 1/72nd Type VIIC deck and floods PE set
« Reply #20 on: 02 Nov , 2016, 14:50 »
From Upgrade set 72-02 1/72nd scale Type VIIC U-Boat Deck & Floods Set Instruction booklet, page 5 "His drawings of the saddle tank hatch covers also proved useful during the design of our hatches. The size of our hatches coincides with Simon’s design, while the locations of our various hatches are very close to his design."

Hi Dougie,
 
I think you were talking about the position of Hatch ‘I1’ (page 16). You were correct, I had miss place this hatch :o It should be location 500 mm aft.

Simon

Offline dougie47

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Re: AMP7202 1/72nd Type VIIC deck and floods PE set
« Reply #21 on: 02 Nov , 2016, 15:58 »
Hi Simon,

Thanks for your help with the hatches, much appreciated.

Cheers,

Dougie

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: AMP7202 1/72nd Type VIIC deck and floods PE set
« Reply #22 on: 03 Nov , 2016, 21:27 »
I've had a look through my photos but unfortunately I can't tell if they covered up the aft container hatch. Annoyingly there are crewmen standing over this part of the deck and I can't see it properly. But I would guess you are right that the very late VIICs and VIIC/41s such as U 250 were buildwith no aft container hatch. There was no opportunity to change to spare torpedoes due to Allied air cover so this makes sense. Sorry I can't provide evidence for you.

Dougie, we know that on U-250 had no aft reserve torpedo container hatches, but I just noted it has the bow reserve torpedo container hatches ::)

Offline dougie47

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Re: AMP7202 1/72nd Type VIIC deck and floods PE set
« Reply #23 on: 04 Nov , 2016, 13:59 »
Hi Simon,

The photos won't be telling lies and provide evidence to support your drawings. Could the bow hatch have been retained but used for a different purpose?

Cheers,

Dougie

Offline NZSnowman

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Re: AMP7202 1/72nd Type VIIC deck and floods PE set
« Reply #24 on: 06 Dec , 2016, 10:55 »
Dougie, do you own Wolfpack: U-Boats at War, 1939-1945 by Philip Kaplan & Jack Currie?

There a very clear photo on page 216 & 217 of the reset for the large deck pole on the stern. It very clearly show the half around shape on the pole ('D2' on page 12 - Upgrade set 72-02 1/72nd scale Type VIIC U-Boat Deck & Floods Set Instruction booklet) being made of wood and not part of the pole in anyway. Its look like it just a stopping to stop the pole sliding forword.

« Last Edit: 06 Dec , 2016, 10:57 by NZSnowman »